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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:34 pm 
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darth_vedder wrote:
You forgot to talk about Johnny Guitar. Please share your thoughts about that song with us, thanks.


He talked about it, said he quite liked it.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:36 pm 
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thodoks wrote:
Why put this record on when you need a pop lift, though? So many other bands and musicians are doing pop better than this record that I can't imagine turning to Pearl Jam to scratch my disposable music itch.


Well because PJ is my favourite band, and their musicianship pretty much always makes me smile (on record). They don't do pop with depth like The Cure, no, but then I don't always want the melancholy of The Cure.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:36 pm 
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darth_vedder wrote:
You forgot to talk about Johnny Guitar. Please share your thoughts about that song with us, thanks.

viewtopic.php?p=3544257#p3544257

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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:36 pm 
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thodoks wrote:
Johnny Guitar is the first marginally interesting song, and the first song on which I enjoy Eddie's delivery. The post-chorus musical interlude and palm mutes about a minute in are inane, and should have been purged. This song is all about the riff and melody.

A song with an approachable and reasonable ambition, with solid execution. Pretty good work here.


Please disregard my post...missed this one.

It's one of my favorites on the album too :thumbsup:


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:36 pm 
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thodoks wrote:
Why put this record on when you need a pop lift, though? So many other bands and musicians are doing pop better than this record that I can't imagine turning to Pearl Jam to scratch my disposable music itch.



Its like comfort food. or a nice old warm blanket from your childhood.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:38 pm 
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If it's any consolation thodoks, Wintersleep are filling my PJ hole at the moment. *snigger*


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:41 pm 
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Another thing I just thought. I understand how some people feel about this album, because I feel it about Radiohead's new one. I find it pretty much unlistenable bar a couple of songs.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:42 pm 
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I saw someone mention this in another thread and I think it's spot on...If another album followed Backspacer shortly afterwards, we could all look at it as a nice detour of a pop album. Instead, it's been nearly 3 years, and this is all we get from them. I don't know how to quite articulate what I'm thinking, but waiting 3 years for a 30 min. pop album, then waiting 3+ years after it just seems damn lazy on PJ's part.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:44 pm 
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Harmless wrote:
thodoks wrote:
Why put this record on when you need a pop lift, though? So many other bands and musicians are doing pop better than this record that I can't imagine turning to Pearl Jam to scratch my disposable music itch.


Well because PJ is my favourite band, and their musicianship pretty much always makes me smile (on record). They don't do pop with depth like The Cure, no, but then I don't always want the melancholy of The Cure.

That's fine, but at what point does loyalty and affection to a band compromise musical curiosity in general? There's just so much good music out there (a fair portion of which I will myself never be able to listen to) that I can't imagine forcing myself to digest something just because I've liked what they've produced in the past.

It's like beer. I have my favorite breweries, but there is so much good beer out there that I'm not willing to force myself to settle for Sierra Nevada's Torpedo IPA just because they're one of my favorite breweries. If I want an IPA, I'm going to look for and consume what I think is the best.

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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:47 pm 
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thodoks wrote:
Harmless wrote:
thodoks wrote:
Why put this record on when you need a pop lift, though? So many other bands and musicians are doing pop better than this record that I can't imagine turning to Pearl Jam to scratch my disposable music itch.


Well because PJ is my favourite band, and their musicianship pretty much always makes me smile (on record). They don't do pop with depth like The Cure, no, but then I don't always want the melancholy of The Cure.

That's fine, but at what point does loyalty and affection to a band compromise musical curiosity in general? There's just so much good music out there (a fair portion of which I will myself never be able to listen to) that I can't imagine forcing myself to digest something just because I've liked what they've produced in the past.

It's like beer. I have my favorite breweries, but there is so much good beer out there that I'm not willing to force myself to settle for Sierra Nevada's Torpedo IPA just because they're one of my favorite breweries. If I want an IPA, I'm going to look for and consume what I think is the best.



I dont care for that argument either. You can always have your go to beer on hand yet try out a million other brews. Life isn't THAT short where you cant do both.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:55 pm 
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Harmless wrote:
Another thing I just thought. I understand how some people feel about this album, because I feel it about Radiohead's new one. I find it pretty much unlistenable bar a couple of songs.

It's one thing if it's just a one-off miss. Nobody's perfect, and bands and musicians can (and should) indulge. I don't really criticize Riot Act because I think it's a failure of execution more than ambition, and everyone misses the mark from time to time. But we're approaching a decade of dubious music from Pearl Jam, and it's to the point where deterioration in ambition and execution has become the rule rather than the exception.

Further, my frustration with the band takes into account the totality of their effort: music, artwork, professionalism, and the live experience. I think they still probably provide a decent live experience, but - ignoring the obvious burdens Ten Club puts on those wanting a complication-free ticketing experience - it strains credibility to deny that the other three criteria aren't far, far below where they've been in the past. For better or worse, and irrespective of tastes, the music isn't what it used to be. As you pointed out, the artwork isn't what it used to be. And god knows the band's professionalism - as measured by their official proxies in the Ten Club (you know, the Tim Biermans of the world) - isn't what it used to be.

All in all, they've done nothing in my estimation in the last seven or eight years to warrant the kind of loyalty and affection no shortage of folks show them. You only get so much good will and margin for error, and they've exhausted both of mine.

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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:57 pm 
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62strat wrote:
thodoks wrote:
Harmless wrote:
thodoks wrote:
Why put this record on when you need a pop lift, though? So many other bands and musicians are doing pop better than this record that I can't imagine turning to Pearl Jam to scratch my disposable music itch.


Well because PJ is my favourite band, and their musicianship pretty much always makes me smile (on record). They don't do pop with depth like The Cure, no, but then I don't always want the melancholy of The Cure.

That's fine, but at what point does loyalty and affection to a band compromise musical curiosity in general? There's just so much good music out there (a fair portion of which I will myself never be able to listen to) that I can't imagine forcing myself to digest something just because I've liked what they've produced in the past.

It's like beer. I have my favorite breweries, but there is so much good beer out there that I'm not willing to force myself to settle for Sierra Nevada's Torpedo IPA just because they're one of my favorite breweries. If I want an IPA, I'm going to look for and consume what I think is the best.



I dont care for that argument either. You can always have your go to beer on hand yet try out a million other brews. Life isn't THAT short where you cant do both.

Exactly. Go-to beer, not go-to brewery. The (Pearl Jam) musical equivalent of my go-to beer is any one of Vitalogy, No Code, Yield, or Binaural, just like my go-to beers are Bells Two-Hearted and Sierra Nevada Pale Ale. But I don't listen to Riot Act or Backspacer because I like the others any more than I drink SN's Porter because I like their Pale Ale.

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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:59 pm 
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I think I may have to re-think my potential adventure into sobriety


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:01 pm 
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thodoks wrote:
Harmless wrote:
Another thing I just thought. I understand how some people feel about this album, because I feel it about Radiohead's new one. I find it pretty much unlistenable bar a couple of songs.

It's one thing if it's just a one-off miss. Nobody's perfect, and bands and musicians can (and should) indulge. I don't really criticize Riot Act because I think it's a failure of execution more than ambition, and everyone misses the mark from time to time. But we're approaching a decade of dubious music from Pearl Jam, and it's to the point where deterioration in ambition and execution has become the rule rather than the exception.

Further, my frustration with the band takes into account the totality of their effort: music, artwork, professionalism, and the live experience. I think they still probably provide a decent live experience, but - ignoring the obvious burdens Ten Club puts on those wanting a complication-free ticketing experience - it strains credibility to deny that the other three criteria aren't far, far below where they've been in the past. For better or worse, and irrespective of tastes, the music isn't what it used to be. As you pointed out, the artwork isn't what it used to be. And god knows the band's professionalism - as measured by their official proxies in the Ten Club (you know, the Tim Biermans of the world) - isn't what it used to be.

All in all, they've done nothing in my estimation in the last seven or eight years to warrant the kind of loyalty and affection no shortage of folks show them. You only get so much good will and margin for error, and they've exhausted both of mine.


I'm kinda close to this, but unlike a lot of folks here, I really enjoy S/T. Yeah, it's not superb, or even damn good, but there is enough there, and some of Backspacer to make one really solid album. With what will nearly be a 4 year wait in between albums, I'm expecting this next one to be their best since Binaural. If not, then sadly, my margin for goodwill shall be pretty much exhausted.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:01 pm 
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thodoks wrote:
Harmless wrote:
thodoks wrote:
Why put this record on when you need a pop lift, though? So many other bands and musicians are doing pop better than this record that I can't imagine turning to Pearl Jam to scratch my disposable music itch.


Well because PJ is my favourite band, and their musicianship pretty much always makes me smile (on record). They don't do pop with depth like The Cure, no, but then I don't always want the melancholy of The Cure.

That's fine, but at what point does loyalty and affection to a band compromise musical curiosity in general? There's just so much good music out there (a fair portion of which I will myself never be able to listen to) that I can't imagine forcing myself to digest something just because I've liked what they've produced in the past.


I don't force myself to digest this album. I digest it because I like it. That's the difference between me and you. For me, I'm prepared to go by the rules this album sets itself, and like it on that basis. We have seven albums full of deep-and-meaningful PJ, they can afford this little diversion and I enjoy it. Simple as that. I listen to plenty of more interesting bands, technically. I'm also enjoying the hell out of Sigur Ros, Valtari. So, it just doesn't work that I'm a more superficial listener just because I like this slightly superficial album. It has an artistic, musical and thematic concept that coheres, and even when I've been lukewarm about it, that fact has kept me trying it. Usually I've liked what I've heard.

thodoks wrote:
It's like beer. I have my favorite breweries, but there is so much good beer out there that I'm not willing to force myself to settle for Sierra Nevada's Torpedo IPA just because they're one of my favorite breweries. If I want an IPA, I'm going to look for and consume what I think is the best.


Again, I'm not going to 'force myself' to listen to a band just because they were great in the past. That is why I've rejected Radiohead's album and it's also why I've rejected S/T. Just horrible and pretty embarrassing in places. So is Backspacer, but on fewer moments for me. I don't have to turn Backspacer off, I just let it play through. It's consistent, maybe never *great*, but always enjoyable. That's all I need from most bands these days. Honestly, I think the 'cleverness' of rock bands is overrated anyway. Thom Yorke is basically the new Matt Bellamy, kind of deluded. He's been so incredibly intelligent in the past, so groundbreaking, now he just rides on the fact that he's supposed to be 'avant-garde'. As long as it sounds like that sonically, it doesn't matter that it's not groundbreaking conceptually. People are fooled. Bleep bloop bleep. So, you know, I'm a pretty critical guy. I could go through everything worth criticising in Backspacer, but I don't think it's worth it.

I've found that review I wrote btw. How do I link to a post, or do I just have to link to the page?


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:02 pm 
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darth_vedder wrote:
I'm expecting this next one to be their best since Binaural.

Oh, bro.

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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:04 pm 
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Harmless wrote:
How do I link to a post, or do I just have to link to the page?

There's a little dog-eared piece of paper in the upper-right hand corner of every post, just to the left of the time/date stamp. That's the hyperlink to individual posts.

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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:07 pm 
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thodoks wrote:
darth_vedder wrote:
I'm expecting this next one to be their best since Binaural.

Oh, bro.


Hey! A guy can hope right? I know, I know, it's probably just a lost cause.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:07 pm 
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thodoks wrote:
Harmless wrote:
Another thing I just thought. I understand how some people feel about this album, because I feel it about Radiohead's new one. I find it pretty much unlistenable bar a couple of songs.

It's one thing if it's just a one-off miss. Nobody's perfect, and bands and musicians can (and should) indulge. I don't really criticize Riot Act because I think it's a failure of execution more than ambition, and everyone misses the mark from time to time. But we're approaching a decade of dubious music from Pearl Jam, and it's to the point where deterioration in ambition and execution has become the rule rather than the exception.


I know that feeling. But I'd rather enjoy the music we have than abandon a life-long fandom. That's the crux. I still like it enough to call them my favourite band. They're not going to make music I'm passionate about just because I want them to. Whatever, they're just people.

thodoks wrote:
Further, my frustration with the band takes into account the totality of their effort: music, artwork, professionalism, and the live experience. I think they still probably provide a decent live experience, but - ignoring the obvious burdens Ten Club puts on those wanting a complication-free ticketing experience - it strains credibility to deny that the other three criteria aren't far, far below where they've been in the past. For better or worse, and irrespective of tastes, the music isn't what it used to be. As you pointed out, the artwork isn't what it used to be. And god knows the band's professionalism - as measured by their official proxies in the Ten Club (you know, the Tim Biermans of the world) - isn't what it used to be.


Yep. Agreed. But all of the above still stands. I just can't leave.

thodoks wrote:
All in all, they've done nothing in my estimation in the last seven or eight years to warrant the kind of loyalty and affection no shortage of folks show them. You only get so much good will and margin for error, and they've exhausted both of mine.


I agree there too. I've only ever been to three shows and that's enough for me, I have a family to feed. I've never obsessively bought posters or boots. I don't have a raging horn everytime they're touring. All I expect from them is great to good albums (my biggest complaint is that they're so busy doing tours I can't go to, they're not making albums more often). But they've been part of my life for a long time and they're a permanent fixture. *shrug*


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 Post subject: Re: Let's actually listen to the albums: Backspacer edition
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:12 pm 
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i really hit the nail on the head in regards to you PJ forum bing-bongs in my interview

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