I was reading the Tolkien wiki and look what I came across:


http://lotr.wikicities.com/wiki/Final_Battle

The published Silmarillion ends with the recounting of the voyage of Eärendil the Mariner, but this is due to an editorial decision by Christopher Tolkien. The Silmarillion as J. R. R. Tolkien originally wrote it ends with a prophecy by Mandos about the Final Battle (or the Dagor Dagorath in Sindarin), often referred to as "The End". The remaining clue to this prophecy is found at the end of Akallabêth, where "Ar-Pharazôn and his mortal warriors who had set foot on Aman were buried by falling hills, imprisoned in the Caves of the Forgotten until the Last Battle and Day of Doom". The account is clearly inspired by and bears many similarities to the Norse legend of Ragnarok.

According to the prophecy, Melkor will discover how to break the Door of Night, and will destroy the Sun and the Moon. For the love of these, Eärendil will return from the sky and shall meet Tulkas, Manwë (or Eönwë his herald) and Túrin Turambar on the plains of Valinor. All the Free Peoples of Middle-earth will participate in this final battle, Elves, Men and Dwarves alike. To their number will be added Ar-Pharazôn and the Númenóreans who landed at Aman in 3319 SA.

There they shall fight with Melkor. Tulkas will wrestle with him, but it will be by the hand of Túrin that finally death and destruction will be dealt to Melkor. Túrin will run his black sword Gurthang (Iron of Death) through Melkor's heart, thus avenging the Children of Húrin (Sind: Hîn Húrin), and the Pelori Mountains will be levelled. The three Silmarils will be recovered from the Earth, sea, and sky, and Fëanor's spirit shall be released from the halls of Mandos to give them to Yavanna, who will break them and rekindle the light of the Two Trees. The battle will end and renew Arda's existence: all the Elves shall awaken and the Powers will be young again.

Following this, there will be a Second Music of the Ainur. This song will sing into being a new world. Men will sing it with the Ainur. It is unknown what the fate of the old races, or of the old world, will be in the new one. Even the Ainur do not know anything of the second world or the Second Music. All the Ainur know is that the Second Music will be greater than the First Music.

Christopher Tolkien removed the prophecy from The Silmarillion based on a 1958 version of the Valaquenta wherein his father wrote that none of Mandos' dooms had declared whether the Marring of Arda would ever be repaired (Christopher Tolkien adopted this passage and used it to close the Quenta Silmarillion). Given this removal of the prophecy Christopher apparently assumed that the Dagor Dagorath had been removed as well. He later noted his surprise at finding references to it and a new version (in which Beren also returns from death for the final battle) written after the Valaquenta passage.

His prophesies don't mean shit until the end does come.

WOW!!!

And one again Turin Turambar Dagnir Glaurunga kicks major ass!! His tale is my favourite from all LoTR universe.

i read all three books and have seen all three movies...

and i am completely lost.

Read Silmarillion. It is about all middle-earth history, from its creation until LoTR. One of the best books of my life.

I've always wanted to read the Silmarillion, but didn't think that I could handle all of that Middle Earth history. I was always under the impression that it was all storys and recounts of events, but no actual action.

There's this one irritating fuck in my English class and on the Academic Decathlon that recites the different chants from LOTR. He'll just start doing the Ent chant or the dwarf chant randomly in class with his irritating squeek voice.

There are a lot of action and Tolkien writing sums up all the history very well, it is not a long book, less than 450 pages.

I'd say that kids like that deserve to be barred from ever using their genitals, but they've pretty much already imposed that punishment on themselves anyways.

I've tried to read the Silmarillion about 5 times... I always get through the first 20 or so pages and give up... I've never given up on a book the way I give up on this one. Maybe I should try again.

can someone still tell me where gandalf came from and why he and the others go to the undying lands at the end?

Possibly: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gandalf#Origin

so gandalf and sauron are equal in power?

yup. gandalf and sauron are both maiar - sauron was corrupted to melkor's service before arda (earth) was created.

there's one line in The Two Towers where Gandalf says, "Olorin I was in my youth in the west that is forgotten." Tolkien actually wrote a text outlining a conference where Manwe and the Valar choose which Wizards (Istari) are to travel from Valinor to Middle-Earth to fight Sauron. Saruman is chosen by Aule, but Manwe, knowing Gandalf to be wise and incorruptible, chooses him to accompany Saruman.


As far as the Silmarillion goes, it is equal to anything in LOTR and in many places surpasses LOTR's mythmaking. Only after reading the Silmarillion can you appreciate what a truly unique mind Tolkien was. This guy created an entire universe and detailed ALL of its history. The whole of LOTR is just the end of the Third Age, whereas the Silmarillion covers everything from creation up till LOTR. If you compare it to real history, all of LOTR would basically be like one of the 20th-century's World Wars: a devastating event in its own right, but only one of mankind's uncountable cataclysms.


Anyway, there are two points to all this: Tolkien is probably the greatest creative genius in history, and I am probably history's biggest nerd.

the Silmarillion is without doubt the most epic thing i've ever, when i imagine the battles in the Silmarillion they make the ones in lotr look tiny

bump for history's greatest author

you should. i know a few people who have tried to read it and failed also... personally i love it. just keep reading and it should click. skip a few chapters if you really must and try one of the later tales, maybe. it's been a long time since i've read it.

some call me tom bombadil