If you are interested in haiku let me tell you a little about it. It is not 5-7-5 syllables. It is an intense moment wrapped up in a seasonal reference so that the recipient can understand it. It is given as a gift. It can be 9 syllables 12 syllables 15 syllables, in fact 17 syllables in the English language is too long. It can be 1 line 2 lines or 3 lines, but I rarely find a good 1 line English language haiku. It is beautiful in it's simplicity. Many books about haiku mention wabi and/or sabi and other Japanese terms for finding the beauty in lonliness or emptiness because without attachment then something can be truly understood for what it is. It is a moment. There usually isn't "ing" phrases. Good haiku do not have dashes. Haiku started as the first part of a game that linked poems together. It was called Hokku at that time if I'm spelling that correctly and usually was complimentary to the host. Linked haiku are called Renga. The next person responds to poem that was just written, not one written a long time ago. Here's one I wrote this morning
autumn morning bolts awake
metro train
The seasonal reference is autumn morning, of course, and metro trains are loud so there is the intense moment of waking from rest which can have it's lonliness about it. There's seasonal almanacs specifically for haiku. I think they are called saijaki. Every two weeks has a different set of seasonal references.
if you want to try renga here's a start
winter sunset
snow on a bicycle seat
_________________ The Little Engine that Could, Babette Hersant, and Rocky Balboa are my heroes.
_________________ i was dreaming through the howzlife yawning car black when she told me "mad and meaningless as ever" and a song came on my radio like a cemetery rhyme for a million crying corpses in their tragedy of respectable existence
So every English teacher I had was wrong and you're right. Interesting.
the issue is that japanese doesn't translate very well, in a poetic sense, to english.
so for english speakers to enjoy the art of haiku, they had to stretch a couple things and hide a couple other things.
in other words, it's not so much that every english teacher you had was wrong as much as it is a case of a giant nit being picked
_________________ i was dreaming through the howzlife yawning car black when she told me "mad and meaningless as ever" and a song came on my radio like a cemetery rhyme for a million crying corpses in their tragedy of respectable existence
Yes, every English teacher you had probably was taught as you were taught - probably by someone who didn't care about haiku. How many of your English teachers mentioned the seasonal almanac? How many mentioned wabi? How many know about Chiyo-ni? If you cared about haiku you would know as much as I do. Haiku is not an elementary school math lesson.
Was it in second grade that you were taught about haiku? That was the first time I learned about haiku, and, yes, it was the 17 syllable lesson. It's my favorite type of poetry so I' ve read a lot about it, and I've read a lot of poems. Just read any book on the essence of haiku, and you'll see that the intensity of a moment should not be restricted by the English language translation of Japanese 17 syllables which in English is about 12 syllables.
_________________ The Little Engine that Could, Babette Hersant, and Rocky Balboa are my heroes.
Yes, every English teacher you had probably was taught as you were taught - probably by someone who didn't care about haiku. How many of your English teachers mentioned the seasonal almanac? How many mentioned wabi? How many know about Chiyo-ni? If you cared about haiku you would know as much as I do. Haiku is not an elementary school math lesson.
Was it in second grade that you were taught about haiku? That was the first time I learned about haiku, and, yes, it was the 17 syllable lesson. It's my favorite type of poetry so I' ve read a lot about it, and I've read a lot of poems. Just read any book on the essence of haiku, and you'll see that the intensity of a moment should not be restricted by the English language translation of Japanese 17 syllables which in English is about 12 syllables.
Using Japanese syllables a haiku is about 17 syllables. I've seen Japanese versions mostly written in 1 vertical line. If anyone out there writes haiku in Japanese do you have any information to add about the translations?
_________________ The Little Engine that Could, Babette Hersant, and Rocky Balboa are my heroes.
I'll back away from my elitist tone. If you want to find out about haiku just look out your window, or go outside. Write two poems. One in 12-15 syllables in 1, 2 or 3 lines. The other in 17 syllables 5-7-5. Look at what is over one hundred feet away and what is within 5 feet. Write about what you see or hear or feel or sense. Do you find a difference in the meaning of the poems? Which do you like better?
_________________ The Little Engine that Could, Babette Hersant, and Rocky Balboa are my heroes.
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:17 pm Posts: 13551 Location: is a jerk in wyoming Gender: Female
Bibliobella wrote:
I'll back away from my elitist tone. If you want to find out about haiku just look out your window, or go outside. Write two poems. One in 12-15 syllables in 1, 2 or 3 lines. The other in 17 syllables 5-7-5. Look at what is over one hundred feet away and what is within 5 feet. Write about what you see or hear or feel or sense. Do you find a difference in the meaning of the poems? Which do you like better?
back when this particular section of the board was a forum for writing, i posted a couple haiku i was kind of proud of.
The End
_________________ i was dreaming through the howzlife yawning car black when she told me "mad and meaningless as ever" and a song came on my radio like a cemetery rhyme for a million crying corpses in their tragedy of respectable existence
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 12:10 am Posts: 10993 Gender: Male
malice wrote:
Bibliobella wrote:
I'll back away from my elitist tone. If you want to find out about haiku just look out your window, or go outside. Write two poems. One in 12-15 syllables in 1, 2 or 3 lines. The other in 17 syllables 5-7-5. Look at what is over one hundred feet away and what is within 5 feet. Write about what you see or hear or feel or sense. Do you find a difference in the meaning of the poems? Which do you like better?
Well, if you want to start a renga, post a haiku now, and I'll respond to it with a haiku of my own.
CHALLLLLENGE!!
i dasn't, for fear of being unmasked
_________________ i was dreaming through the howzlife yawning car black when she told me "mad and meaningless as ever" and a song came on my radio like a cemetery rhyme for a million crying corpses in their tragedy of respectable existence
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