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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 3:42 pm 
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i thought toby mcguire was a good spiderman. I like this guy better, but both were solid

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 3:55 pm 
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Peeps wrote:
i wouldnt say they are taking their cues from batman about rebooting. they are using common sense.


as much as i liked toby as parker it is not feasible to have a 40 year old toby doing web of spiderman pt 18.

personally from my view instead of a reboot they should have just done a recast and explained everything away that its like a comic, a new artist and his view of what spiderman looks like


i will also go on record and say that the actor playing spidey nailed it this time around as far as the wise assery. i think it had more to do with the script than i can say toby though


The script was excellent, and particularly in the part where he first meets his uncle's murderer. You can feel his anger there; the scene is hilarious, and his personality really comes out. Cocky, arrogant, but only because of that anger welling up inside of him... He's got the guy who killed his uncle right in his sights, and he can do what he likes to him. That was great. So it was script and great character acting combined.


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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 4:44 pm 
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yeah everything relating to the personal character development was really strong. I just found myself divorced from the actual hero/villain conflict

One of my favorite stan lee cameos too

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 5:57 pm 
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Peeps wrote:
i wouldnt say they are taking their cues from batman about rebooting. they are using common sense.


as much as i liked toby as parker it is not feasible to have a 40 year old toby doing web of spiderman pt 18.

personally from my view instead of a reboot they should have just done a recast and explained everything away that its like a comic, a new artist and his view of what spiderman looks like


i will also go on record and say that the actor playing spidey nailed it this time around as far as the wise assery. i think it had more to do with the script than i can say toby though

That's fine, but none of that has anything to do with what I'm saying. I'm not referring to the idea of rebooting, but their approach to the reboot. Look at how the strands of the story are laid out on "Amazing Spider-Man", look at how they did a solid, full-fledged origin story where they took their time getting to the costume, look at the general "setting the wheels in motion rather than cramming everything into the first film" approach to storytelling. Look at the idea of Mentor vs. Student. Look at how both film series are set to be trilogies. Look at the overall tones of both films. It's very clear that Sony saw what Nolan was doing and thought "yeah, let's have a crack at this." It's not a copy, it's merely seeing what works and applying it to their own properties. DC is going to do the same with Justice League, and I'd be surprised if their approach to it wasn't modeled after how Marvel built The Avengers.

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:24 pm 
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spiderman came out well before batman (toby) and was a trilogy before hand, this spiderman is following that. not cause of batman but because its only logical unless you get a 15 year old to commit to the three movies over the next few years of his life.

the first spidy also took its time to get to the costume also, as well as his figuring out how his powers worked. it wasnt a quick heres spiderman, they took time to develop that also.

do basically i dont agree with much of anything you are saying in the fact is all related to to batman

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:51 pm 
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Peeps wrote:
spiderman came out well before batman


If you're going to follow that logic, I can also say there were Batman films decades before there was a Spider-Man film. But I'm not talking about the past series, I'm talking about the current one, so that's irrelevant.

Peeps wrote:
and was a trilogy before hand, this spiderman is following that.


They weren't a trilogy, they just happened to be three films. They didn't tell a coherent story with an arc, with a beginning and an end, across the three films. A "trilogy" is more than just three of something.

And more than that, even if it ended up being a "trilogy" (because they were three movies), it wasn't by design.
They were moving forward with production of Spider-Man 4 before Sony decided to reboot the character.
http://web.archive.org/web/201003261818 ... tory.jhtml

Peeps wrote:
the first spidy also took its time to get to the costume also, as well as his figuring out how his powers worked. it wasnt a quick heres spiderman, they took time to develop that also.


Barely. He's already in the costume by the end of the first act. By contrast, both Batman Begins and Amazing Spider-Man showed the emergence of the costumed persona as a second-act catalyst.

Peeps wrote:
do basically i dont agree with much of anything you are saying in the fact is all related to to batman


That's your prerogative, but the signs are very clear. The Nolan approach to weaving a superhero story has been a gamechanger, and it's only natural that Sony will follow suit with their big superhero property. Just like Avengers was a gamechanger and WB will probably take a lot of their cues from it.

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:39 pm 
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theplatypus wrote:
Peeps wrote:
spiderman came out well before batman


If you're going to follow that logic, I can also say there were Batman films decades before there was a Spider-Man film. But I'm not talking about the past series, I'm talking about the current one, so that's irrelevant.


and i am saying that the current spiderman is probably (havent seen the next two yet) going to follow a similar trajectory as the first. hes already fell in love with gwen (mary jane) and realized he cannot have a relationship with her cause his enemies will come after her, just like he did in the toby films

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Peeps wrote:
and was a trilogy before hand, this spiderman is following that.


They weren't a trilogy, they just happened to be three films. They didn't tell a coherent story with an arc, with a beginning and an end, across the three films. A "trilogy" is more than just three of something.

And more than that, even if it ended up being a "trilogy" (because they were three movies), it wasn't by design.
They were moving forward with production of Spider-Man 4 before Sony decided to reboot the character.
http://web.archive.org/web/201003261818 ... tory.jhtml


doesnt matter what was planned. is star wars not a trilogy cause they made more? many still consider it two trilogies mashed together. my opinion stands that is indeed a trilogy and follows a story arc, when you include young harry hell bent on revenge. sure the bad guys dont follow along with all three films, but the same story is continued.

parker dealing with the fact he cant let anyone know who he is (who he loves), harrys plot for revenge against spiderman, and mary janes quest to show peter that they can be together despite the dangers

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Peeps wrote:
the first spidy also took its time to get to the costume also, as well as his figuring out how his powers worked. it wasnt a quick heres spiderman, they took time to develop that also.


Barely. He's already in the costume by the end of the first act. By contrast, both Batman Begins and Amazing Spider-Man showed the emergence of the costumed persona as a second-act catalyst.


this may well be but id have to see the running times of each movie. regardless, it still took some time.

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Peeps wrote:
do basically i dont agree with much of anything you are saying in the fact is all related to to batman


That's your prerogative, but the signs are very clear. The Nolan approach to weaving a superhero story has been a gamechanger, and it's only natural that Sony will follow suit with their big superhero property. Just like Avengers was a gamechanger and WB will probably take a lot of their cues from it.


using my points listed above i stand 100% behind my assertion that the first spiderman was indeed following several plot points making it at the very least a trilogy

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 8:06 pm 
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stip wrote:
yeah everything relating to the personal character development was really strong. I just found myself divorced from the actual hero/villain conflict

One of my favorite stan lee cameos too


Well, I *never* find hero / villain conflicts believable. I don't need to. Usually I find superhero movies to be two different movies: the 'realistic' origin, and then the brightly-coloured, fake swashbuckling second half. I usually lose interest in that second half, because I don't believe in it. But this film gripped me all the way through because, very cleverly, shots of 'reality' and vulnerability are carried through even into the Spider-Man persona. So, as I said, you get real seething "fuck you" anger in the part with the murderer. It's darkly hilarious and hilariously dark. You also get the unmasking when he saves the kid from the burning car. You get Spider-Man sitting on a building, away from public view, and phoning his mum to say he'll bring home some milk (in costume!) and finally, you got him playing on a game on his phone from his web in the sewer. All of those touches meant that for me, there was no awkward jarring from 'real world' to 'superhero world'. He was still Peter Parker, but in his Spider-Man suit. That's not going to be everyone's thing, but I really loved it and speaking as a guy who doesn't really *do* superheroes as a 'thing', this kept me hooked.

Having said all that, I will concede that the chemistry between Spider-Man and The Lizard *could* have been built up a bit more. There didn't seem to be quite enough motivation. I wonder whether the motivation came not as much from a personal vendetta as a responsibility to take care of the city. The Lizard was going to smash shit up without Spider-Man intervention. So that's enough I suppose, but the chemistry between Spider-Man and his uncle's murderer is *so* palpable. It's hard to not wish that it had lasted longer, perhaps as a side-story (which they might've got away with, considering how streamlined the film was as a whole).


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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 10:53 pm 
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yeah I loved every scene you just described. The high school human touches especially made me very invested in Spiderman. Just not who he was actually fighting. Which is why it was a good movie but not a great movie.

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 12:24 am 
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so it seems the movie is actually good right? im kinda off because its a reboot and i wanted to see Spidey without having to learn again about his powers and stuff....
was the movie a hit in the box office ?


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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:28 am 
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stip wrote:
yeah I loved every scene you just described. The high school human touches especially made me very invested in Spiderman. Just not who he was actually fighting. Which is why it was a good movie but not a great movie.


Yup.

I'm thinking it's a great set up to a great trilogy though, if they spend more time setting up the threat next time.


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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:30 am 
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VinylGuy wrote:
so it seems the movie is actually good right? im kinda off because its a reboot and i wanted to see Spidey without having to learn again about his powers and stuff....
was the movie a hit in the box office ?


I'm not going to answer the box office thing because I don't know and it doesn't matter.

See it. It's a reboot, but with a very different tone, a cleverer script (IMO), and a more streamlined origin story (which is slightly different, btw; I'm guessing it's inspired by a different line of comics, don't know which ones yet).


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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:59 am 
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Harmless wrote:
VinylGuy wrote:
so it seems the movie is actually good right? im kinda off because its a reboot and i wanted to see Spidey without having to learn again about his powers and stuff....
was the movie a hit in the box office ?


I'm not going to answer the box office thing because I don't know and it doesn't matter.

See it. It's a reboot, but with a very different tone, a cleverer script (IMO), and a more streamlined origin story (which is slightly different, btw; I'm guessing it's inspired by a different line of comics, don't know which ones yet).

Yeah, I liked this quite a bit. Great performances. Nice tone. Really liked all the origin stuff. Would totally agree about investment in the bad guy and the "threat" of the movie.

Liked it more than Rami's original and Spider-man 3. Probably not as much as Spider-Man 2, however.

Super excited to see where they take the franchise.

Really interesting to see Steve Kloves's name on the script. Didn't know that.

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:22 am 
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you guys liked this one? i think it was pretty bad...dull action sequences, stupid characters, Spidey with the mask off most of the time...aunt may? where was her?? The lizard was really bad too...
i wasnt expecting anything good, but it felt so poor...

worst part: c thomas howell...he is old! and still cant act...and the sequence with him helping spider man...really bad.


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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 3:14 pm 
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Yeah, I had a blast watching it. Certainly wouldn't say the action is dull (in fact, I thought there was some great tension), nor the characters stupid.

And I don't get why people have a problem with Spider-man taking his mask off. He does it all the time in the comics I read as a kid. And each time was really well motivated in this film.

Plus Stone and Garfield are incredible. Their chemistry is red-hot and spot-on. They totally nailed the hungry adolescence, the spark of young love. They don't ever overdo it.

The conflict with The Lizard is the only thing I felt down about. And some of the CGI (The Lizard specifically, but also the tiny lizards running around everywhere all the time) is dubious. But I thought the Spidey CGI was actually much improved from Rami's trilogy.

But, on the balance, I'd say it was a successful reboot. They have a lot of room to play now, and I'm excited to see what happens next. Though, I do admit an sever aversion to Jamie Foxx. I hate that guy. But I'll try to give him a fair shake in TASM 2.

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 4:59 pm 
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Where this movie really succeeds is the human side of the character, Peter Parker as a well-rounded outsider rather than a lazy archetypal "nerd". The guy was genuinely troubled and conflicted in a way that didn't really come through in the previous movies. I think Andrew Garfield did a really great job conveying it (notice how restless and jittery he is in the opening scenes, and how incredibly still he is by the end of the movie), and Marc Webb told the story wonderfully, with emotional sequences that help us empathize with the character on a deeper level (the skateboard scene reflecting a pure joy and optimism he's never really experienced before: he has these amazing powers that enable him to be more than an awkward, gangly dweeb; he's made a connection with a scientist who worked with his dad and they're going to collaborate towards completing his dad's work; he's making progress with a girl he likes and she likes him back). The denouement was really good and suitably bittersweet. There are lots of great little details that make this a good character study of Peter Parker. This is his movie, and Spider-Man is just a part of it.

Where the movie kind of falls flat is the Lizard stuff. I didn't think it was developed enough. I didn't really buy his motivation, I never really got to understand what he was all about, and I agree with durden that his relationship with Peter could have been developed further. In fact, it was, it just didn't end up on the finished cut: I bought the DVD as a gift for my little brother, and watched some of the deleted scenes. There's a lot more Connors/Peter interaction there, including a very powerful scene right after Uncle Ben dies. I guess it was cut for time.

All in all, it's a really good superhero movie. Better than Captain America or Thor, though nowhere near as good as Iron Man. The action is fun, the acting is great, Emma Stone is adorable, and the score is powerful in that old-school heroic Richard Donner sort of way, though our hero is ten times more grounded, flawed and human than any Superman.

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:02 pm 
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I will definitely be renting this very soon after it comes out.

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:05 pm 
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theplatypus wrote:
Where the movie kind of falls flat is the Lizard stuff. I didn't think it was developed enough. I didn't really buy his motivation, I never really got to understand what he was all about, and I agree with durden that his relationship with Peter could have been developed further. In fact, it was, it just didn't end up on the finished cut: I bought the DVD as a gift for my little brother, and watched some of the deleted scenes. There's a lot more Connors/Peter interaction there, including a very powerful scene right after Uncle Ben dies. I guess it was cut for time

Interesting. I saw it via Netflix and the disc didn't have any special features. I liked this enough to purchase it on its own merits, but now I'm really excited to pick it up. Really like to see the scenes you're describing. More flesh on that story's bones and this is (like Stip said) a great movie instead of just a really good one.

Also, totally agree that it's better than Thor and Cpt America. Also agree it's not Iron Man.

Did you like it more or less than Singer's X-films?

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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:09 pm 
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well i didnt get what you guys did with this one. I do like Garfield as Peter Parker, a very messy parker who make mistakes most of the movie (the sequence he gave Connors, telling Stacy to go to Oscorp, his uncle death was stupid too), and the interaction between him and gwen is good too.
The Lizard? really bad cgi, and why is he making all this trouble? He says he wont experiment with humans and in the next scene he is experimenting with himslef...why?
Sally Field? why is she in the movie? beside making that funny face all the time. Captain Stacy?? in the comics you feel he is the man in charge, he might be wrong about spidey, but hes main interest is the safety of people. Here, he sounds obsessed with spider man when, actually, Spidey didnt do anything yet. It felt wrong.
Its not a bad movie at all, but its really disposable. Im sure the sequel will be better though, because this is a talented crew, but i dont feel like seeing it again.


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 Post subject: Re: THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN (aka Spidey 4) July 3, 2012
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:12 pm 
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VinylGuy wrote:
his uncle death was stupid too

What did you think was so stupid about Uncle Ben's death?

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