20. Which of the following best describes your feelings about nationalism? A. It is healthy for a nation’s citizens to have a nationalistic pride in their country. 7.7% B. I see no reason to be proud of where I was born. 11.6% C. Nationalism is a very dangerous mob mentality which can lead to a dangerous attitude towards persons who do not share the same spirit. 11.6% D. It depends on the instance; it can be healthy, while at other times, it can be dangerous. 73.1% On a scale of 1-5, this issue is rated 3.25 for importance.
Male (3.21) A. 9.3% B. 11.6% C. 11.6% D. 67.4%
Female (3.50) A. B. 10% C. 10% D. 80%
Americans (3.51) A. 10.3% B. 10.3% C. 12.8% D. 66.7%
Non-Americans (2.83) A. B. 14.3% C. 7.1% D. 78.6%
Looks like this is one that nobody really cares about, or has a solid opinion on.
_________________ "Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires." -- John Steinbeck
Post subject: Re: RM Litmus Test Survey- Updated Results on Page 21!
Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 10:46 pm
Unthought Known
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:55 am Posts: 9080 Location: Londres
B, cos the only time when I'm nationalistic is when there's sports on, and when I'm drunk and theres people trying to get me to chant Aussie Aussie Aussie Oi Oi Oi.
Post subject: Re: RM Litmus Test Survey- Updated Results on Page 21!
Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 10:48 pm
Administrator
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:53 pm Posts: 20537 Location: The City Of Trees
Hinny wrote:
B, cos the only time when I'm nationalistic is when there's sports on, and when I'm drunk and theres people trying to get me to chant Aussie Aussie Aussie Oi Oi Oi.
I think part of the problem may be that I can agree with at least 3 of the choices at the same time without contradicting myself.
I think that was the problem. And D got to be the easiest "sometimes good, sometimes bad" answer.
_________________ "Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires." -- John Steinbeck
At the point when nationalism becomes dangerous it's xenophobia, though.
But how do you seperate the two? That line can be crossed very rapidly. For instance, attacking persons who won't salute the flag or engage in other similar nationalistic customs, or demonizing a group for not being a true insert-nationality-here. And yes, as far as the western world goes, the vast majority of my examples would come from the past, when nationalism was much stronger.
_________________ "Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires." -- John Steinbeck
I chose C btw. Even though that clearly isn't always, or even usually the case, I think nationalism is very dangerous when it becomes more than a simple pride in ones' heritage. I think it quickly escalates from mere nationistic pride to an actively dangerous sort of xenophobia quickly and without warning.
_________________ "Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires." -- John Steinbeck
Post subject: Re: RM Litmus Test Survey- Updated Results on Page 21!
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 7:44 pm
Former PJ Drummer
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 1:32 am Posts: 17563
aprilfifth wrote:
bart d. wrote:
At the point when nationalism becomes dangerous it's xenophobia, though.
But how do you seperate the two? That line can be crossed very rapidly. For instance, attacking persons who won't salute the flag or engage in other similar nationalistic customs, or demonizing a group for not being a true insert-nationality-here. And yes, as far as the western world goes, the vast majority of my examples would come from the past, when nationalism was much stronger.
How do you separate love from obsession? Or industriousness from greed? There isn't anything good that can't turn bad if taken too far.
_________________
Quote:
The content of the video in this situation is irrelevant to the issue.
Post subject: Re: RM Litmus Test Survey- Updated Results on Page 21!
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 7:52 pm
Reissued
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 3:38 pm Posts: 20059 Gender: Male
i put d
nationalism isn't inherently bad(it can cause people to strive to achieve something greater, be it equality wise, innovation wise, etc, but it can also be bad when brought to the level of xenophobia).
_________________ stop light plays its part, so I would say you've got a part
At the point when nationalism becomes dangerous it's xenophobia, though.
But how do you seperate the two? That line can be crossed very rapidly. For instance, attacking persons who won't salute the flag or engage in other similar nationalistic customs, or demonizing a group for not being a true insert-nationality-here. And yes, as far as the western world goes, the vast majority of my examples would come from the past, when nationalism was much stronger.
How do you separate love from obsession? Or industriousness from greed? There isn't anything good that can't turn bad if taken too far.
But what that is really good can come from nationalism? To me, there are a few things that are mildly positive side effects of nationalism, but many more dangerous and negative things that can result from it.
_________________ "Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires." -- John Steinbeck
Post subject: Re: RM Litmus Test Survey- Updated Results on Page 21!
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 8:23 pm
Former PJ Drummer
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 1:32 am Posts: 17563
aprilfifth wrote:
bart d. wrote:
aprilfifth wrote:
bart d. wrote:
At the point when nationalism becomes dangerous it's xenophobia, though.
But how do you seperate the two? That line can be crossed very rapidly. For instance, attacking persons who won't salute the flag or engage in other similar nationalistic customs, or demonizing a group for not being a true insert-nationality-here. And yes, as far as the western world goes, the vast majority of my examples would come from the past, when nationalism was much stronger.
How do you separate love from obsession? Or industriousness from greed? There isn't anything good that can't turn bad if taken too far.
But what that is really good can come from nationalism? To me, there are a few things that are mildly positive side effects of nationalism, but many more dangerous and negative things that can result from it.
If you admire Lincoln, I think you have to admit there is plenty of good that can come from loving your country. Look at the Gettysburg Address, one of the greatest speeches of all time and deeply nationalistic. In the 20th century, look at Finland standing up to the Soviets, or the shockingly strong resistance the Norwegians put up against Hitler. There are plenty of examples of nationalism being put to good use.
_________________
Quote:
The content of the video in this situation is irrelevant to the issue.
Post subject: Re: RM Litmus Test Survey- Updated Results on Page 21!
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 10:04 pm
Unthought Known
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:55 am Posts: 9080 Location: Londres
bart d. wrote:
If you admire Lincoln, I think you have to admit there is plenty of good that can come from loving your country. Look at the Gettysburg Address, one of the greatest speeches of all time and deeply nationalistic. In the 20th century, look at Finland standing up to the Soviets, or the shockingly strong resistance the Norwegians put up against Hitler. There are plenty of examples of nationalism being put to good use.
On the flipside, nationalism artificially creates an oppositional frame of mind, of inclusion and exclusion, when cooperation is more beneficial-
Joyeux Noel is screening on tv tonight here, perhaps the greatest example ever of what happens when people throw away the chains of nationalism and just embrace each other's company. Jeez I love this film.
Post subject: Re: RM Litmus Test Survey- Updated Results on Page 21!
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 10:19 pm
Former PJ Drummer
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 1:32 am Posts: 17563
Hinny wrote:
bart d. wrote:
If you admire Lincoln, I think you have to admit there is plenty of good that can come from loving your country. Look at the Gettysburg Address, one of the greatest speeches of all time and deeply nationalistic. In the 20th century, look at Finland standing up to the Soviets, or the shockingly strong resistance the Norwegians put up against Hitler. There are plenty of examples of nationalism being put to good use.
On the flipside, nationalism artificially creates an oppositional frame of mind, of inclusion and exclusion, when cooperation is more beneficial-
That's a universal human trait, though. Nationalism doesn't create it, it exists with or without nations. Look at Communism. It's completely anti-nationalist but is also one of the most divisive philosophies ever created. Religion too.
_________________
Quote:
The content of the video in this situation is irrelevant to the issue.
Post subject: Re: RM Litmus Test Survey- Updated Results on Page 21!
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:19 pm
Former PJ Drummer
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 5:51 am Posts: 17078 Location: TX
I think nationalism is pretty important.
I have a very hard time with the idea of every single country on Earth being a mixing pot like the US, with no racial or national identification beyond what area the country is in. Even though I live here, I sometimes struggle with the idea that America is a mixing pot, but then again the idea of a mixing pot IS our identity and it is rather unique.
To some extent I believe nations should have some kind of self-determined identity, whether that is based on their race, culture, or history. So I guess I think nationalistic tendencies are the only way to preserve that. Without nationalism, the world would be one giant collective culture and all unique and individual aspects of different groups of people would be swallowed by that.
In some cases, I really do understand feelings of xenophobia. I don't think xenophobia should be a natural part of nationalism, but when the perceived identity of the nation becomes threatened I can understand how xenophobia would develop.
So while I think it would be nice if we all got along with each other, I also think it would be nice for different countries to keep their different identities, and people should be able to be proud of that.
21. Which of the following most closely resembles your feelings on embryonic-stem cell research? (Note: If you choose “B”, you may also select “C” if you wish.) A. It is unequivocally positive, and needs to be pursued by federal research grants, etc. 53.8% B. I do not object to it on a moralistic ground, rather on the basis that it has yet to yield tangible results, therefore it is not worthy of federal funding. 13.5% C. If privately funded, I have no objections to continued research. 30.8% D. I object to it on a moral ground. 1.9% On a scale of 1-5, this issue is rated 3.62 for importance.
Male (3.64) A. 52.4% B. 11.9% C. 33.3% D. 2.4%
Female (3.50) A. 60% B. 20% C. 20% D.
American (3.51) A. 53.8% B. 10.3% C. 33.3% D. 2.6%
Non-American (3.80) A. 53.8% B. 23.1% C. 23.1% D.
_________________ "Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires." -- John Steinbeck
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