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 Post subject: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 2:27 am 
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NC State in Raleigh has some tunnel where you can spray paint whatever you want there. The night after the election some students wrote some racist messages. NCAAP wants them expelled. ACLU says that it is protected free speech.

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UNC system to study hate crime policy
Posted: Nov. 25, 2008
Updated: Nov. 25 10:09 p.m.

CHAPEL HILL, N.C. — The University of North Carolina system will examine whether a policy is needed to address possible hate crimes on the system's 16 campuses.
UNC President Erskine Bowles said he would appoint a commission to study the issue and give him its recommendation by March 31.

The move comes three weeks after four North Carolina State University students painted racist graffiti in the "Free Expression Tunnel" on campus. Two of the messages, which were painted the night Barack Obama won the presidential election, said: "Let's shoot that (N-word) in the head" and "Hang Obama by a noose."

Officials with the state chapter of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People called for the students to be expelled, and they criticized what they termed a "tepid response" to the incident by N.C. State officials.

State NAACP President Rev. William Barber said he wanted to talk with Bowles about a more aggressive policy for handling hate crimes on the 16 UNC campuses, though prosecutors did not deem the State incident a crime.

Bowles said no grounds exist for expelling the four N.C. State students, but he was troubled by the incident.

"I find this whole incident to be deplorable," he said. "It hurts deeply. It is offensive, and I believe it is just plain wrong."

In addition to considering a hate crimes policy, Bowles said he also is looking at requiring all new university students to take classes in diversity training.

Wake County District Attorney Colon Willoughby told NAACP officials that the N.C. State graffiti didn't amount to a hate crime, so he had no plans of pressing criminal charges. Authorities would be hard-pressed to prove an intent of any threat against Obama from the students, he said.

Officials with the state chapter of the American Civil Liberties Union on Tuesday expressed concern about efforts to punish students for graffiti, saying hateful speech isn't a hate crime.

Jennifer Rudinger, executive director of ACLU North Carolina, said the anti-Obama statements were reprehensible, but treating them as a hate crime amounts to censorship.

"Hate speech alone, with no criminal actions that follow, is protected by the First Amendment," Rudinger said. "We agree with the NAACP that more diversity training campus-wide would be a good idea, and we applaud the students and administrators who have risen up to denounce what was written on that wall and who have demonstrated that the sentiments on that wall are not welcome here. But censorship is not the answer."
Barber said the graffiti isn't a free-speech issue.

"They don't know in their heart what it's like to hear those words. They don't know what it's like to have a history of leaders being shot in the head," he said.

The NAACP hasn't decided whether to lobby lawmakers for a change in state law to make racist graffiti a hate crime, he said.

Reporter: Erin Hartness
Photographer: Pete James
Web Editor: Matthew Burns


http://chapelhill.mync.com/site/chapelh ... hate-crime

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 2:42 am 
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That's incredibly ignorant and wrong, but I guess it would be protected by the first.

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 2:52 am 
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As PD uses to say, if you want an idiot to be recognized as such for most people, free speech will do the job.

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:20 am 
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Based on the thread title I thought the ACLU was suing some athletic council.

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:26 am 
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cutuphalfdead wrote:
Based on the thread title I thought the ACLU was suing some athletic council.

Haha! I didn't notice before.

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 7:27 am 
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Quote:
"They don't know in their heart what it's like to hear those words. They don't know what it's like to have a history of leaders being shot in the head," he said.

You sure about that buddy?

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:35 pm 
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Buffalohed wrote:
Quote:
"They don't know in their heart what it's like to hear those words. They don't know what it's like to have a history of leaders being shot in the head," he said.

You sure about that buddy?


Image

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:39 pm 
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B wrote:
Buffalohed wrote:
Quote:
"They don't know in their heart what it's like to hear those words. They don't know what it's like to have a history of leaders being shot in the head," he said.

You sure about that buddy?


Image


You don't even have to go back much further than MLK to think of one:
Image

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:48 pm 
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The ACLU can be fucking retarded sometimes

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:54 pm 
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glorified_version wrote:
The ACLU can be fucking retarded sometimes

The ACLU is completely internally consistent in their philosophy whether you like a particular result or not.

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:56 pm 
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punkdavid wrote:
glorified_version wrote:
The ACLU can be fucking retarded sometimes

The ACLU is completely internally consistent in their philosophy whether you like a particular result or not.


Yeah, so was Hitler

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LittleWing sometime in July 2007 wrote:
Unfortunately, it's so elementary, and the big time investors behind the drive in the stock market aren't so stupid. This isn't the false economy of 2000.


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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:58 pm 
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glorified_version wrote:
punkdavid wrote:
glorified_version wrote:
The ACLU can be fucking retarded sometimes

The ACLU is completely internally consistent in their philosophy whether you like a particular result or not.


Yeah, so was Hitler

Spoiler: show
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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:59 pm 
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You've got to admit they defend some pretty stupid shit sometimes

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LittleWing sometime in July 2007 wrote:
Unfortunately, it's so elementary, and the big time investors behind the drive in the stock market aren't so stupid. This isn't the false economy of 2000.


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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:01 pm 
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Look, I'm not disparaging on the organization. They do more for liberty in this country than CATO or Heritage.

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LittleWing sometime in July 2007 wrote:
Unfortunately, it's so elementary, and the big time investors behind the drive in the stock market aren't so stupid. This isn't the false economy of 2000.


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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:01 pm 
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glorified_version wrote:
You've got to admit they defend some pretty stupid shit sometimes

They defend people exercising their First Amendment rights. Period.

They defend some pretty stupid PEOPLE sometimes...

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:03 pm 
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The first amendment doesn't give someone the right to yell "fire" in a crowded theater

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LittleWing sometime in July 2007 wrote:
Unfortunately, it's so elementary, and the big time investors behind the drive in the stock market aren't so stupid. This isn't the false economy of 2000.


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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:06 pm 
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glorified_version wrote:
The first amendment doesn't give someone the right to yell "fire" in a crowded theater


Making a hateful comment is not the same as causing a panic.

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:20 pm 
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Yeah, I'm on board with the ACLU on this one. I'm not a big fan of this 'hate crime' business if the incident in question wouldn't ordinarily be a crime.


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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:21 pm 
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glorified_version wrote:
The first amendment doesn't give someone the right to yell "fire" in a crowded theater


Only because the theater is private property. If you own the theater, you can set your own policies regarding whether "fire" is allowed to be yelled.

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 Post subject: Re: NCAAP vs. ACLU
PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:27 pm 
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$úñ_DëV|L wrote:
glorified_version wrote:
The first amendment doesn't give someone the right to yell "fire" in a crowded theater


Only because the theater is private property. If you own the theater, you can set your own policies regarding whether "fire" is allowed to be yelled.

That's not the rationale behind the rule. It's causing a public panic, as Sandler said above.

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