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 Post subject: Madtown
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:04 pm 
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Thousands protesting at the capitol.

One facebook chain status reads:

"The latest from Dems inside the Capitol: All Dem senators have gone into hiding but here is the big news: two GOP senators have also vanished, the Assembly does not have quorum and state troopers have refused to track down the senators. This last part is rumor among Senate and Assembly staff: that Walker wants the National Guard to do it. Pass this news on if it isn't getting published in the press."

Hell if I know. My brother who works at the capitol says they're probably giving them a pass and not let them vote on it.

http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolit ... 81289.html


Senate Democrats boycott Thursday vote on Walker's budget plan

Madison — Law enforcement officers are searching for Democratic senators boycotting a Senate vote on Gov. Scott Walker's budget-repair plan Thursday in an attempt to bring the lawmakers to the floor to allow Republicans to act on the bill.

As Republicans denounced the move, one Democratic senator said that he believed most of the members of his caucus are in another state.

In a telephone interview, Senate Minority Leader Mark Miller (D-Monona) declined to give his location but acknowledged that at least one other Democrat was with him. He said that law enforcement would be able to compel him and his members to the Senate floor if they are located in Wisconsin.

"I can tell you this - we're not all in one place," Miller said. "This is a watershed moment unlike any that we have experienced in our political lifetimes. The people have shown that the government has gone too far . . .  We are prepared to do what is necessary to make sure that this bill gets the consideration it needs."

The bill would help balance the state budget by cutting benefits for public workers and stripping them of almost all their union bargaining rights. The political drama is taking place amid a massive demonstration of union members that is clogging the hallways of the Capitol and making the rotunda ring with chanted slogans as loud as the revving of a motorcycle engine.

Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald (R-Juneau) said that Democrats were "not showing up for work" and that police were searching for them to bring them to the floor.

"That's not democracy. That's not what this chamber is about," Fitzgerald said of the boycott to reporters.

A spokesman for Walker had no immediate comment but said one would be released soon. As of Thursday afternoon, the Wisconsin State Patrol had not received a request to locate missing Democrats, said a spokeswoman for the state Department of Transportation, which oversees the patrol.

It wasn't immediately which police agency was searching for the lawmakers.

Sen. Tim Cullen (D-Janesville) confirmed Thursday that Democrats are boycotting the Senate action on the bill in efforts to block a quorum and keep the measure from passing. Because 20 senators of the 33-member house are needed to be present to pass a fiscal bill, the body's 19 Republicans will not be enough to pass the budget repair bill without at least one Democrat present.

Cullen said he believed at least most of the Democrats were outside Wisconsin, though he declined to say where.

"I think they're all out of state. I am anyway," Cullen said.

Speculation in the Capitol pointed to Illinois as the state where Democrats had headed.

Cullen said Democrats hope delaying the bill will give more time for union demonstrators to win over any possible wavering Republicans. He said the decision was made by other Democrats at a meeting at which he was not present.

Sen. Fitzgerald said he believed the last time such an action happened was in October 1995. At that time, then-Sen. Joe Wineke (D-Verona) fled the Senate to block passage of the $250 million Miller Park Stadium deal that raised the sales tax in the Milwaukee area. In that incident, all senators were required to be present for the final vote because of a parliamentary maneuver.

The tactic wasn't winning over Sen. Rob Cowles (R-Green Bay), a moderate whom unions had been trying to court to vote against the bill. Cowles called the blockage of the Senate vote an attempt to "shut down democracy."

The Senate convened at 11:30, with 17 Republicans but no Democrats present. After a prayer and the pledge of allegiance, action was immediately disrupted by demonstrators in the gallery shouting, "Freedom, democracy, unions."

Senate President Mike Ellis (R-Neenah) made a call of the house to bring the three additional senators needed to vote on the bill to the Senate floor.

If a Democrat does show up for the vote, a handful of GOP senators will decide the fate of Walker's bill.

The Senate is meeting amid massive demonstrations that have so packed the Capitol that movement outside the Senate chambers is difficult at best.

Spokesmen for the Republican governor and Sen. Fitzgerald said they were confident that the GOP lawmakers had the votes they needed to pass the bill without further changes. Walker has said that the proposal's cuts to worker benefits and to decades-old union bargaining laws are needed to help balance the state's gaping budget shortfall in this year and the next two.

Republicans control the Senate 19-14, meaning they can lose only two votes and still pass the bill if all Democrats oppose it. Some Republicans have shown reluctance about the bill, though so far none have said publicly that they will vote against it.

Even after voting for the proposal in the Legislature's budget committee just before midnight Wednesday, Sen. Luther Olsen (R-Ripon) showed his concern about the effects of the proposal on workers.

"I will probably vote for it" on the Senate floor, Olsen said.

On a 12-4 party-line vote Wednesday, the Joint Finance Committee added new civil-service protections for local government employees and kept cuts to public worker benefits. The budget committee began debating the bill at 7:45 p.m. Wednesday, after Republicans spent hours behind closed doors crafting the changes.

"This will pass in that form" adopted by the committee, Sen. Fitzgerald said.

His brother, Assembly Speaker Jeff Fitzgerald (R-Horicon), said he also expected the Legislature to accept the changes the committee adopted and not make any further ones.

Some senators attempted to make significant changes to the bill Wednesday, but it appeared their efforts had failed.

The changes the committee adopted would require all local governments to create civil-service systems similar to the one for the state. It would also allow limited-term employees to keep their benefits. Some limited-term employees have worked for the state for years, and the original version of the bill would have taken away all their health care coverage and retirement benefits.

The debate in the committee was impassioned and at times emotional.

"People have said they're willing to sacrifice. Why are we going after people's rights?" asked Rep. Tamara Grigsby (D-Milwaukee).

But Rep. John Nygren (R-Marinette), whose wife is a teacher, said he believed the bill was needed to ensure schools are run efficiently.

"What about the right of the taxpayer to run a frugal school district?" Nygren said.

The changes did not appease the thousands of teachers and state workers who have filled the Capitol for two days.

They booed loudly Wednesday day as they learned the bill still would take away their union rights as they watched the committee proceedings on televisions mounted in the Capitol Rotunda.

"I think it's disgusting," said John Bausch, a Darlington music teacher in elementary and middle school.

"This is not what Wisconsin is all about. We've had collective bargaining for (50) years and to throw it all out without our say is a disgrace."

Thousands more came to the Capitol after Mary Bell, president of the Wisconsin Education Association Council, urged teachers and other Wisconsin residents to come to Madison on Thursday and Friday. She stopped short of asking teachers to walk off their jobs.

In Milwaukee, Superintendent Gregory E. Thornton said teachers are expected to be at work Thursday and Friday, and failure to do so, without a valid excuse, will result in disciplinary action.

WEAC's effort came as Madison schools closed Wednesday and Thursday because teachers called in sick so they could demonstrate and lobby legislators. Madison schools will be closed Thursday for the same reason.

Walker, who proposed the bill, said Wednesday he was "disappointed" with the action by the Madison teachers and that he appreciates that other public employees are showing up for work. He said he respects workers' right to demonstrate but that he is "not intimidated into thinking that they're the only voices out there."

In a sign of the national attention the proposal is drawing, U.S. Secretary of Education Arne Duncan has scheduled a telephone call with Walker for Thursday, said Jim Bradshaw, a spokesman for the federal agency. The Associated Press reported Duncan said Wednesday at a Denver conference of teacher unions and school administrators that the move in Wisconsin and other states to strip teachers of bargaining rights worries him.

In an interview with WTMJ-TV (Channel 4), President Barack Obama said public workers have to be prepared to make concessions but that he thought Walker's plan was unduly harsh on unions.

Walker offered the bill to help shore up the state's finances in advance of a budget to be delivered Tuesday that is expected to include major cuts in areas like aid to local schools and governments.

He first wants the budget repair bill passed to help clear up a $137 million budget shortfall for the fiscal year ending June 30 and ease solving a deficit of more than $3 billion over the next two years. The cuts to benefits would save taxpayers nearly $330 million through mid-2013.

Major elements of the budget-repair bill remain in place. It would require most public workers to pay half their pension costs - typically 5.8% of pay for state workers - and at least 12% of their health care costs. It applies to most state and local employees but does not apply to police, firefighters and state troopers, who would continue to bargain for their benefits.

Except for police, firefighters and troopers, raises would be limited to inflation unless a bigger increase was approved in a referendum. The non-law enforcement unions would lose their rights to bargain over anything but wages, would have to hold annual elections to keep their organizations intact and would lose the ability to have union dues deducted from state paychecks.

The most significant change the Joint Finance Committee approved would require local governments that don't have civil-service systems to create an employee grievance system within months. Those local civil-service systems would have to address grievances for employee termination, employee discipline and workplace safety.

The bill also gives Walker's Department of Health Services the power to write rules that would change state laws dealing with medical care for children, parents and childless adults; prescription drug plans for seniors; nursing home care for the elderly; and long-term care for the elderly and disabled outside of nursing homes.

The programs that could see changes under the proposal would include the BadgerCare Plus and BadgerCare Core plans, Family Care and SeniorCare.

Lawmakers planned to modify the bill so that the Walker administration could drop people from BadgerCare Plus because of having too high an income temporarily, but not permanently. Current income eligibility standards would be restored on Jan. 1, 2015, under the changes the committee adopted.


Last edited by I Hail Randy Moss on Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Madison is Mad
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:10 pm 
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i'm pretty glad i left wisconsin last fall.


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 Post subject: Re: Madison is Mad
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:36 am 
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lol @ everything about this story

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 Post subject: Re: Madison is Mad
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:38 am 
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thodoks wrote:
lol @ everything about this story

but not my "one liner" :(


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 Post subject: Re: Madison is Mad
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:42 am 
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I hope this doesn't affect PJ Fest this summer.

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 Post subject: Re: Madison is Mad
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:43 am 
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guys, i heard a middle school blew up today.


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 Post subject: Re: Madison is Mad
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:48 am 
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Spike wrote:
guys, i heard a middle school blew up today.

heroes emerged.

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 Post subject: Re: Madison is Mad
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:35 am 
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E.H. Ruddock wrote:
Spike wrote:
guys, i heard a middle school blew up today.

heroes emerged.

heads swelled.


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 Post subject: Re: Madison is Mad
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:25 am 
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you guys are pieces of poop.


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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:53 pm 
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Is this even legal? I mean the union busting. I thought government unions were like herpes, once you had one outbreak...

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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:09 pm 
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broken iris wrote:
Is this even legal? I mean the union busting. I thought government unions were like herpes, once you had one outbreak...


well that's why i posted this because i was hoping you all had the answers. I have FoxNews telling me one thing and Lawrence O'Donnell and Rachel Maddow on MSNBC telling me different. I have my conservative father telling me one thing and my democratic brother saying different. Can Gov. Scott Walker do what he's doing? Fuck if i know.


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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:23 pm 
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Ok. Not necessarily research, but these are the basics of what im hearing

Pro-Walker

-As an example, teachers pay nothing into their health insurance. Under former Gov. Doyle, teachers who have taught for 15+ years can retire at age 57, and still get their health benefits paid for until their 65. THIS NEEDS TO STOP. Teachers will have to pay in for their insurance in the same way that the private sector does, and as my father (a police officer) does.

-There is a deficit problem in Wisconsin, just like there is one every where else in America. And we need to fix it by increasing the public workers contributions, and cancelling any bargain negotiations by Unions. And in this way there is no interference in trying to balance the budget.

Anti-Walker

-Busting up any negotiations with Unions is destroying the blue collar workers right to speak.

-There is no deficit problem in Wisconsin if you look at the numbers. It is all a myth. This is a conservative scheme to destroy Unions.

-A lot of public workers get paid shit compared to the private sector. To increase their contributions (or to start their contributions) would be unjust. Especially with teachers who start out at 30,000 a year (not the 15+ year teachers who get paid well over 50,000 to 65,000, but even they are complaining).


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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:33 pm 
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40% of teachers called in sick or just didn't show up today.

I really dont' know what to think about that...


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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:45 pm 
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I Hail Randy Moss wrote:
There is no deficit problem in Wisconsin if you look at the numbers. It is all a myth.

I'm not well-acquainted with the specifics of Wisconsin's budget, but I'm highly skeptical of this claim. To the extent that unsustainable administrative budgets, pension plans, and healthcare benefits are constraining Wisconsin's cash flow, the state should absolutely pursue measures that contain those costs (they're accountable to taxpayers too).

It's such fun to watch the Red Team and Blue Team try to frame debates. Lots of noise, little signal.

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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:46 pm 
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I can't wait to see how this country will react when the federal government attempts to get its fiscal house in order.

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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:51 pm 
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thodoks wrote:
I can't wait to see how this country will react when the federal government attempts to get its fiscal house in order.

Michigan is flipping the fuck out. Our new governor has decided to do a 2 year budget in the black. Of course its going to make him a 1 termer, but our state will be better off. Cutting education, cutting Low income tax credits, increasing public worker costs, and the thing that will kill him- taxing seniors.


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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:12 pm 
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team spike

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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:17 pm 
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Skitch Patterson wrote:
thodoks wrote:
I can't wait to see how this country will react when the federal government attempts to get its fiscal house in order.

Michigan is flipping the fuck out. Our new governor has decided to do a 2 year budget in the black. Of course its going to make him a 1 termer, but our state will be better off. Cutting education, cutting Low income tax credits, increasing public worker costs, and the thing that will kill him- taxing seniors.


well fantastic, why don't you tell the public workers of wisconsin this. They seem to think our state is the only state doing such radical changes.


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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:27 pm 
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Alex wrote:
team spike


Image


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 Post subject: Re: Madtown
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:30 pm 
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I Hail Randy Moss wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
thodoks wrote:
I can't wait to see how this country will react when the federal government attempts to get its fiscal house in order.

Michigan is flipping the fuck out. Our new governor has decided to do a 2 year budget in the black. Of course its going to make him a 1 termer, but our state will be better off. Cutting education, cutting Low income tax credits, increasing public worker costs, and the thing that will kill him- taxing seniors.


well fantastic, why don't you tell the public workers of wisconsin this. They seem to think our state is the only state doing such radical changes.


what other deep cuts to the budget would you advocate, IHRM?

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