Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:19 pm Posts: 39068 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA Gender: Male
Does it really matter who was the stronger of the two? Is that a judgement that a person can make when getting pummeled? "hmmm ... this kid's about 120, and I'm about 210, but I have asthma. Of course, I did have a good breakfast this morning. I think I've done everything I can do get out of this, but I didn't try relating to him on the level of a young black man in today's society." Even if he wasn't taking a serious beating, I'm sure it seemed much worse than it was.
I doubt I would shoot him. Fuck, I've never even touched a gun. But it's impossible to say if Zimmerman thought his life was in danger or not. A lot of people would have, and he is clearly not a stable or rational man.
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
Again, before today, this was all one sided. After today's news of eyewitnesses, there is absolutely no way this is even prosecuted for murder let alone convicted. The story is essentially over.
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Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 12:47 am Posts: 46000 Location: Reasonville
Long story short: if you really want to kill someone, chase them down for no good reason, then let them beat you up, then shoot them in the chest.
_________________ No matter how dark the storm gets overhead They say someone's watching from the calm at the edge What about us when we're down here in it? We gotta watch our backs
Long story short: if you really want to kill someone, chase them down for no good reason, then let them beat you up, then shoot them in the chest.
Argh, looks like CB is the voice of reason here. The facts, as they appear today, are that Zimmerman was following this guy in his car against the request of the 911 operator, and then got out of the car and pursued him further while carrying a loaded gun. This does not justify Trayvon attacking Zimmerman, or mean Trayvon is not your run of mill street thug in the making, or justify the resulting tragedy, but I have trouble believing it's self defense or "standing your ground" for exactly what CB says above. The behavior of the police in this situation didn't help.
Don't kid yourself the media will ever present situations like this in a non-inflammatory manner, whatever the evidence ends up being. Racial conflict sells and they are not nonprofits.
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:53 pm Posts: 20537 Location: The City Of Trees
I'm going to be boring: instead of armchair quarterbacking this case, I'm going to wait for the facts to come in, and let a jury trial or a plea bargain determine the fate of those involved.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:34 am Posts: 12700 Location: ...a town in north Ontario...
Green Habit wrote:
I'm going to be boring: instead of armchair quarterbacking this case, I'm going to wait for the facts to come in, and let a jury trial or a plea bargain determine the fate of those involved.
_________________ I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:53 pm Posts: 20537 Location: The City Of Trees
PhilPritchard wrote:
Green Habit wrote:
I'm going to be boring: instead of armchair quarterbacking this case, I'm going to wait for the facts to come in, and let a jury trial or a plea bargain determine the fate of those involved.
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 12:20 am Posts: 5198 Location: Connecticut Gender: Male
given2trade wrote:
Zimmerman also isn't "white", 4/5. Last I checked, Hispanics don't rule America and easily get away with murder.
There is no race crime here.
This notion that Hispanics can't be "white" has always confused me. Zimmerman is white. Just look at him. There are millions of Latinos in America as white as people from Europe.
And anyway, even if you want to classify him as non-white, it can still be a race crime. Zimmerman is not black, and the 911 tape suggests he may not like them.
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:53 pm Posts: 20537 Location: The City Of Trees
Sandler wrote:
given2trade wrote:
Zimmerman also isn't "white", 4/5. Last I checked, Hispanics don't rule America and easily get away with murder.
There is no race crime here.
This notion that Hispanics can't be "white" has always confused me. Zimmerman is white. Just look at him. There are millions of Latinos in America as white as people from Europe.
And anyway, even if you want to classify him as non-white, it can still be a race crime. Zimmerman is not black, and the 911 tape suggests he may not like them.
The great punkdavid explained it better than anyone else before:
Zimmerman also isn't "white", 4/5. Last I checked, Hispanics don't rule America and easily get away with murder.
There is no race crime here.
This notion that Hispanics can't be "white" has always confused me. Zimmerman is white. Just look at him. There are millions of Latinos in America as white as people from Europe.
And anyway, even if you want to classify him as non-white, it can still be a race crime. Zimmerman is not black, and the 911 tape suggests he may not like them.
The 911 calls really don't suggest that. He is asked, "is the person white, black, or hispanic" and he responded black. News media reports: "he said there was a black man". He only said that after he was asked!
In other news, the 13 year old kid that swears that Zimmerman was on the ground and yelling for help (not mentioned in this video but mentioned in the article below) is BLACK
In addition, an eyewitness, 13-year-old Austin Brown, told police he saw a man fitting Zimmerman's description lying on the grass moaning and crying for help just seconds before he heard the gunshot that killed Martin.
_________________ CrowdSurge and Ten Club will conduct further investigation into this matter.
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2007 6:21 am Posts: 23078 Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina Gender: Male
Green Habit wrote:
Sandler wrote:
given2trade wrote:
Zimmerman also isn't "white", 4/5. Last I checked, Hispanics don't rule America and easily get away with murder.
There is no race crime here.
This notion that Hispanics can't be "white" has always confused me. Zimmerman is white. Just look at him. There are millions of Latinos in America as white as people from Europe.
And anyway, even if you want to classify him as non-white, it can still be a race crime. Zimmerman is not black, and the 911 tape suggests he may not like them.
The great punkdavid explained it better than anyone else before:
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 12:20 am Posts: 5198 Location: Connecticut Gender: Male
given2trade wrote:
The 911 calls really don't suggest that. He is asked, "is the person white, black, or hispanic" and he responded black. News media reports: "he said there was a black man". He only said that after he was asked!
So what was he referring to when he said "fucking coon?" Maybe there was a racoon getting in his way as he followed the kid?
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2007 6:21 am Posts: 23078 Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina Gender: Male
Sandler wrote:
given2trade wrote:
The 911 calls really don't suggest that. He is asked, "is the person white, black, or hispanic" and he responded black. News media reports: "he said there was a black man". He only said that after he was asked!
So what was he referring to when he said "fucking coon?" Maybe there was a racoon getting in his way as he followed the kid?
It sounds a lot more like "fucking punks".
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