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 Post subject: If I owned the Cleveland Cavaliers
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:02 am 
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I would call this man and tell him to name his price

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Think about it.
We all know that Phil is not done and doesn't like the way things ended in LA. He could start fresh in Cleveland with the greatest player in the game at 20 years old to build around. Who wouldn't want to go to Cleveland if Phil was coach?

Do it Cleveland. Don't let it pass you by. Phil coaching a bad Knicks team or taking a massive check from Cuban just doesn't make sense.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:40 pm 
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I think he was there plan all along

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 Post subject: Re: If I owned the Cleveland Cavaliers
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:50 pm 
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Athletic Supporter wrote:
I would call this man and tell him to name his price

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Think about it.
We all know that Phil is not done and doesn't like the way things ended in LA. He could start fresh in Cleveland with the greatest player in the game at 20 years old to build around. Who wouldn't want to go to Cleveland if Phil was coach?

Do it Cleveland. Don't let it pass you by. Phil coaching a bad Knicks team or taking a massive check from Cuban just doesn't make sense.


has phil ever shown that he can develop players?... he seems to be more of a i-prefer-the-pieces-in-place kinda guy


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 2:14 pm 
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If you owned the Cleveland Cavaliers then you would be Usher.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 2:14 pm 
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If I were the Cavaliers, I'd hire whoever Lebron wants.

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-Ernie Accorsi in his final address to the NY Giants locker room before retiring as GM in January of 2007


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 4:44 pm 
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flavdave wrote:
If you owned the Cleveland Cavaliers then you would be Usher.
:lol:

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 4:51 pm 
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Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
If I were the Cavaliers, I'd hire whoever Lebron wants.


Which is the mentality of pro players and owners alike that gets coaches fired on average of 2.6 years (less if you're black) to begin with.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 4:55 pm 
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Chris_H_2 wrote:
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
If I were the Cavaliers, I'd hire whoever Lebron wants.


Which is the mentality of pro players and owners alike that gets coaches fired on average of 2.6 years (less if you're black) to begin with.


players dictating what coach is different from what you're talking about. There are few players with the clout to do that.

what gets coaches fired is that you can't fire the players. simple as that.

it's too hard to overhaul rosters in the NBA on a short-term basis, it's easier to just make a coaching change.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:04 pm 
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Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
Chris_H_2 wrote:
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
If I were the Cavaliers, I'd hire whoever Lebron wants.


Which is the mentality of pro players and owners alike that gets coaches fired on average of 2.6 years (less if you're black) to begin with.


players dictating what coach is different from what you're talking about. There are few players with the clout to do that.

what gets coaches fired is that you can't fire the players. simple as that.

it's too hard to overhaul rosters in the NBA on a short-term basis, it's easier to just make a coaching change.


I don't know, I think I'd have to disagree with you as it applies to the NBA. Players like Kobe Bryant, Allen Iverson, Lebron James, Tracy MacGrady, Jason Kidd, Steve Francis, etc. all have the clout to dictate who they want as head coaches. If they don't get what they want, they demand to be traded. If not, they stop listening to the coach, get him fired, and then use whomever they feel should be coaching as leverage in contract negotiations. Look at Jermaine O'Neil. He swore that if he knew Isiah Thomas was going to be fired from Indiana, he would have never re-signed. One of the conditions he used to re-sign was that he was assured Thomas would return as head coach of Indiana.

In no other league does this apply than the NBA. The idea that you can't fire the players but can only fire the coach applies to all sports.


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 Post subject: Re: If I owned the Cleveland Cavaliers
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:04 pm 
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pearljamminagain wrote:
Athletic Supporter wrote:
I would call this man and tell him to name his price

Image

Think about it.
We all know that Phil is not done and doesn't like the way things ended in LA. He could start fresh in Cleveland with the greatest player in the game at 20 years old to build around. Who wouldn't want to go to Cleveland if Phil was coach?

Do it Cleveland. Don't let it pass you by. Phil coaching a bad Knicks team or taking a massive check from Cuban just doesn't make sense.


has phil ever shown that he can develop players?... he seems to be more of a i-prefer-the-pieces-in-place kinda guy


definatly correct. Phil has a shitload of rings, but he went to a team that already had Jordan and Pippen and then to a team that had Shaq and Kobe.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:10 pm 
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it is going to be a crazy offseason. look at all the teams that will be in the phil sweepstakes: knicks, lakers, cavs, mavericks(cuban might throw a shitload of money @ phil), blazers,timberwolves

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 7:18 pm 
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lunkin wrote:
it is going to be a crazy offseason. look at all the teams that will be in the phil sweepstakes: knicks, lakers, cavs, mavericks(cuban might throw a shitload of money @ phil), blazers,timberwolves


Throw the Pistons in there too because I have a feeling Larry Brown is going to be done with coaching after this season considering the health problems.

I can't stand Phil Jackson, he is a fraud. Me and you could have coached those Bulls and Lakers teams to titles. I'd give him some respect if he did something like Larry Brown did last year, or even what Greg Povich has done in S.A. It is hard to argue with 9 titles but I truly and honestly believe he is a fraud.

I love LeBron, love his personality, love his game. Is anyone else tired of all the better than Jordan stuff, the commercials, the commentators pushing that agenda? It's rediculous.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:24 pm 
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jimmac24 wrote:
I can't stand Phil Jackson, he is a fraud. Me and you could have coached those Bulls and Lakers teams to titles. I'd give him some respect if he did something like Larry Brown did last year, or even what Greg Povich has done in S.A. It is hard to argue with 9 titles but I truly and honestly believe he is a fraud.

then why hadn't they won before?

Or does this mean Del Harris and Doug Collins are the worst head coaches in history?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:39 pm 
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I'm going to take the EXTREME anti-Phil position just for argument's sake. I don't necessarily believe all of the following:

-anyone could have won 6 rings with MJ and Scottie in their primes
-Tex Winter implemented the triangle, not Phil
-if not for the refs, they would have lost to the Kings
-if not for Blazers choke, they would have lost in conference finals that first year
-why didn't they beat an inferior team (Detroit) last year?
-if he was as great a coach as everyone claims he was, why couldn't he get Shaq and Kobe to get along?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:44 pm 
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Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
I'm going to take the EXTREME anti-Phil position just for argument's sake. I don't necessarily believe all of the following:

-anyone could have won 6 rings with MJ and Scottie in their primes
-Tex Winter implemented the triangle, not Phil
-if not for the refs, they would have lost to the Kings
-if not for Blazers choke, they would have lost in conference finals that first year
-why didn't they beat an inferior team (Detroit) last year?
-if he was as great a coach as everyone claims he was, why couldn't he get Shaq and Kobe to get along?
i agree w/ the blazers choke but last year there was nothing he could have done about detroit b/c they were playing on another level and as far as shaq and kobe their hatred for each other was on a level far beyond fixable. phil is a good coach that knows how to "pick his spots". anyteam that gets him will improve dramatically

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:47 pm 
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Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
-if he was as great a coach as everyone claims he was, why couldn't he get Shaq and Kobe to get along?


phil is a coach, not a babysitter


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:49 pm 
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Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
-if he was as great a coach as everyone claims he was, why couldn't he get Shaq and Kobe to get along?


even kobe's kid hates him

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:50 pm 
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Mitchell613 wrote:
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
-if he was as great a coach as everyone claims he was, why couldn't he get Shaq and Kobe to get along?


phil is a coach, not a babysitter


Part of his legacy is how he was able to get elite players to sacrifice ego for the good of the team.

While it's possible NO coach would have been able to help those two personalities co-exist, I think his reputation as a "leader of men" takes a hit.

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“You’re good kids, stay together. Trust each other and be good teammates to one another. I believe there is a championship in this room.”

-Ernie Accorsi in his final address to the NY Giants locker room before retiring as GM in January of 2007


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:29 pm 
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Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
Part of his legacy is how he was able to get elite players to sacrifice ego for the good of the team.


Hmm, you mean like Scotty Pippen, who refused to enter the game during the last play of the 1994 playoffs because Phil drew up a play that had Tony Kukoc taking the last shot?

I wouldn't necessarily say that Phil was the king of making players check their egos at the door. A large part of the success of the Bulls was that Michael Jordan commanded the respect of his teammates. People knew their places on a Jordan team. What Phil did was simply remind them that their leader happened to be the greatest player of all-time. It was more Jordan than Phil that got players to sacrifice egos.

I also think that what you saw last year with Gary Payton demonstrates just how ego-driven players are as a whole, notwithstanding Phil Jackson as a coach.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:33 pm 
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Chris_H_2 wrote:
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
Part of his legacy is how he was able to get elite players to sacrifice ego for the good of the team.



Quote:
Hmm, you mean like Scotty Pippen, who refused to enter the game during the last play of the 1994 playoffs because Phil drew up a play that had Tony Kukoc taking the last shot?


this supports my assertion. I'm not saying the "legacy" is accurate.....I'm just saying that's what's often cited as one of his strong points.

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-Ernie Accorsi in his final address to the NY Giants locker room before retiring as GM in January of 2007


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