Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:53 pm Posts: 20537 Location: The City Of Trees
Screw getting the first overall pick. There hasn't been a can't miss prospect since Peyton Manning over 12 years ago, and there's been plenty of busts at the same time. It's a pretty rare occurrence, and the amount of money you have to sink on a guy who hasn't played a down of NFL football is ridiculous.
I'm very proud that the Broncos have gone the longest of any team without having a top ten pick.
Joined: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:50 pm Posts: 10229 Location: WA (aka Waaaaaaaahhhh!!) Gender: Male
OK let's assume the NFL gets a handle on the contracts and guaranteed money for the top picks. Let's say they can get some kind of rookie scale similar to the NBA and the $$$ comes back down to earth. Now what? 4-12 and the 5th pick...or 0-16 and a guarantee on the guy you REALLY want?
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:08 am Posts: 22978 Gender: Male
Bammer wrote:
OK let's assume the NFL gets a handle on the contracts and guaranteed money for the top picks. Let's say they can get some kind of rookie scale similar to the NBA and the $$$ comes back down to earth. Now what? 4-12 and the 5th pick...or 0-16 and a guarantee on the guy you REALLY want?
0-16 no. Now if the difference is 3-13 and 4-12, then im okay with rooting for the loss. BUT trust me (again- Lions fan) that 0-16 is rough to deal with. real rough. My daughter was walking, and talking before the lions won a game in her lifetime. 16 months without so much as a win is not fun.
Joined: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:50 pm Posts: 10229 Location: WA (aka Waaaaaaaahhhh!!) Gender: Male
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
OK let's assume the NFL gets a handle on the contracts and guaranteed money for the top picks. Let's say they can get some kind of rookie scale similar to the NBA and the $$$ comes back down to earth. Now what? 4-12 and the 5th pick...or 0-16 and a guarantee on the guy you REALLY want?
0-16 no. Now if the difference is 3-13 and 4-12, then im okay with rooting for the loss. BUT trust me (again- Lions fan) that 0-16 is rough to deal with. real rough. My daughter was walking, and talking before the lions won a game in her lifetime. 16 months without so much as a win is not fun.
Fair enough. As a casual pro fan, I don't think that extra win or two is important in the grand scheme of things. I realize it's a "WIN NOW" league, but some teams just have to be realistic. If the 49ers step it up this season, then I think the Seahawks are one of those teams that needs to ask themselves "what good does a losing season do us?" Compared to "What good does it do us to get a local QB who goes #1 in the draft, has his head on straight, is a freak athlete, is a stand-up guy, and would pull in tons of new fans?"
I just don't think I can be convinced that running out a 5-win team this year accomplishes something better than 0 wins.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:08 am Posts: 22978 Gender: Male
Bammer wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
OK let's assume the NFL gets a handle on the contracts and guaranteed money for the top picks. Let's say they can get some kind of rookie scale similar to the NBA and the $$$ comes back down to earth. Now what? 4-12 and the 5th pick...or 0-16 and a guarantee on the guy you REALLY want?
0-16 no. Now if the difference is 3-13 and 4-12, then im okay with rooting for the loss. BUT trust me (again- Lions fan) that 0-16 is rough to deal with. real rough. My daughter was walking, and talking before the lions won a game in her lifetime. 16 months without so much as a win is not fun.
Fair enough. As a casual pro fan, I don't think that extra win or two is important in the grand scheme of things. I realize it's a "WIN NOW" league, but some teams just have to be realistic. If the 49ers step it up this season, then I think the Seahawks are one of those teams that needs to ask themselves "what good does a losing season do us?" Compared to "What good does it do us to get a local QB who goes #1 in the draft, has his head on straight, is a freak athlete, is a stand-up guy, and would pull in tons of new fans?"
I just don't think I can be convinced that running out a 5-win team this year accomplishes something better than 0 wins.
Obviously if you're just a casual fan, then you wouldnt be able to be convinced, because you don't actually care about a specific organization the way that someone really follows the team does.
Joined: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:50 pm Posts: 10229 Location: WA (aka Waaaaaaaahhhh!!) Gender: Male
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
OK let's assume the NFL gets a handle on the contracts and guaranteed money for the top picks. Let's say they can get some kind of rookie scale similar to the NBA and the $$$ comes back down to earth. Now what? 4-12 and the 5th pick...or 0-16 and a guarantee on the guy you REALLY want?
0-16 no. Now if the difference is 3-13 and 4-12, then im okay with rooting for the loss. BUT trust me (again- Lions fan) that 0-16 is rough to deal with. real rough. My daughter was walking, and talking before the lions won a game in her lifetime. 16 months without so much as a win is not fun.
Fair enough. As a casual pro fan, I don't think that extra win or two is important in the grand scheme of things. I realize it's a "WIN NOW" league, but some teams just have to be realistic. If the 49ers step it up this season, then I think the Seahawks are one of those teams that needs to ask themselves "what good does a losing season do us?" Compared to "What good does it do us to get a local QB who goes #1 in the draft, has his head on straight, is a freak athlete, is a stand-up guy, and would pull in tons of new fans?"
I just don't think I can be convinced that running out a 5-win team this year accomplishes something better than 0 wins.
Obviously if you're just a casual fan, then you wouldnt be able to be convinced, because you don't actually care about a specific organization the way that someone really follows the team does.
So you would prefer mediocre season after mediocre season?
The alternative I'm proposing is ONE horrible season as a stepping stone toward (theoretical) longterm success.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:08 am Posts: 22978 Gender: Male
Bammer wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
OK let's assume the NFL gets a handle on the contracts and guaranteed money for the top picks. Let's say they can get some kind of rookie scale similar to the NBA and the $$$ comes back down to earth. Now what? 4-12 and the 5th pick...or 0-16 and a guarantee on the guy you REALLY want?
0-16 no. Now if the difference is 3-13 and 4-12, then im okay with rooting for the loss. BUT trust me (again- Lions fan) that 0-16 is rough to deal with. real rough. My daughter was walking, and talking before the lions won a game in her lifetime. 16 months without so much as a win is not fun.
Fair enough. As a casual pro fan, I don't think that extra win or two is important in the grand scheme of things. I realize it's a "WIN NOW" league, but some teams just have to be realistic. If the 49ers step it up this season, then I think the Seahawks are one of those teams that needs to ask themselves "what good does a losing season do us?" Compared to "What good does it do us to get a local QB who goes #1 in the draft, has his head on straight, is a freak athlete, is a stand-up guy, and would pull in tons of new fans?"
I just don't think I can be convinced that running out a 5-win team this year accomplishes something better than 0 wins.
Obviously if you're just a casual fan, then you wouldnt be able to be convinced, because you don't actually care about a specific organization the way that someone really follows the team does.
So you would prefer mediocre season after mediocre season?
The alternative I'm proposing is ONE horrible season as a stepping stone toward (theoretical) longterm success.
the talent difference between #1 and #7, except in very rare cases, is not going to be a deal breaker. A good organization will usually make the right picks, no matter where they are in the draft to stop mediocrity from being a long term thing.
Joined: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:50 pm Posts: 10229 Location: WA (aka Waaaaaaaahhhh!!) Gender: Male
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
OK let's assume the NFL gets a handle on the contracts and guaranteed money for the top picks. Let's say they can get some kind of rookie scale similar to the NBA and the $$$ comes back down to earth. Now what? 4-12 and the 5th pick...or 0-16 and a guarantee on the guy you REALLY want?
0-16 no. Now if the difference is 3-13 and 4-12, then im okay with rooting for the loss. BUT trust me (again- Lions fan) that 0-16 is rough to deal with. real rough. My daughter was walking, and talking before the lions won a game in her lifetime. 16 months without so much as a win is not fun.
Fair enough. As a casual pro fan, I don't think that extra win or two is important in the grand scheme of things. I realize it's a "WIN NOW" league, but some teams just have to be realistic. If the 49ers step it up this season, then I think the Seahawks are one of those teams that needs to ask themselves "what good does a losing season do us?" Compared to "What good does it do us to get a local QB who goes #1 in the draft, has his head on straight, is a freak athlete, is a stand-up guy, and would pull in tons of new fans?"
I just don't think I can be convinced that running out a 5-win team this year accomplishes something better than 0 wins.
Obviously if you're just a casual fan, then you wouldnt be able to be convinced, because you don't actually care about a specific organization the way that someone really follows the team does.
So you would prefer mediocre season after mediocre season?
The alternative I'm proposing is ONE horrible season as a stepping stone toward (theoretical) longterm success.
the talent difference between #1 and #7, except in very rare cases, is not going to be a deal breaker. A good organization will usually make the right picks, no matter where they are in the draft to stop mediocrity from being a long term thing.
I'm sure you're right about that. I'm talking about a specific situation where the player in question is local, loved, and really damn good. AND the team needs someone who plays his position.
Lose 16 games, draft Locker, reinvigorate the team.
Win 5 games, suffer through the next decade with Charlie Whitehurst and then whoever they replace him with.
Joined: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:50 pm Posts: 10229 Location: WA (aka Waaaaaaaahhhh!!) Gender: Male
Bammer wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
Bammer wrote:
OK let's assume the NFL gets a handle on the contracts and guaranteed money for the top picks. Let's say they can get some kind of rookie scale similar to the NBA and the $$$ comes back down to earth. Now what? 4-12 and the 5th pick...or 0-16 and a guarantee on the guy you REALLY want?
0-16 no. Now if the difference is 3-13 and 4-12, then im okay with rooting for the loss. BUT trust me (again- Lions fan) that 0-16 is rough to deal with. real rough. My daughter was walking, and talking before the lions won a game in her lifetime. 16 months without so much as a win is not fun.
Fair enough. As a casual pro fan, I don't think that extra win or two is important in the grand scheme of things. I realize it's a "WIN NOW" league, but some teams just have to be realistic. If the 49ers step it up this season, then I think the Seahawks are one of those teams that needs to ask themselves "what good does a losing season do us?" Compared to "What good does it do us to get a local QB who goes #1 in the draft, has his head on straight, is a freak athlete, is a stand-up guy, and would pull in tons of new fans?"
I just don't think I can be convinced that running out a 5-win team this year accomplishes something better than 0 wins.
Obviously if you're just a casual fan, then you wouldnt be able to be convinced, because you don't actually care about a specific organization the way that someone really follows the team does.
So you would prefer mediocre season after mediocre season?
The alternative I'm proposing is ONE horrible season as a stepping stone toward (theoretical) longterm success.
the talent difference between #1 and #7, except in very rare cases, is not going to be a deal breaker. A good organization will usually make the right picks, no matter where they are in the draft to stop mediocrity from being a long term thing.
I'm sure you're right about that. I'm talking about a specific situation where the player in question is local, loved, and really damn good. AND the team needs someone who plays his position.
Lose 16 games, draft Locker, reinvigorate the team.
Win 5 games, suffer through the next decade with Charlie Whitehurst and then whoever they replace him with.
And then watch Locker either...
A) Drift off into obscurity with the Raiders
or
B) Enjoy great success on another team outside of Seattle
(Kinda like when the Mariners passed on Tim Lincecum from UW...and have been kicking themselves ever since)
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:53 pm Posts: 20537 Location: The City Of Trees
Quote:
Lose 16 games, draft Locker, might reinvigorate the team.
Win 5 games, draft Luck, still might reinvigorate the team.
FTFY.
I know you're a Locker homer and would like to see him stay in Seattle from a fan's perspective, but there's always more than one way that a team can get better, and it doesn't always involve the first overall pick.
EDIT:
Bammer wrote:
And then watch Locker either...
A) Drift off into obscurity with the Raiders
This won't happen, since thankfully the Patriots have their first round pick.
Joined: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:50 pm Posts: 10229 Location: WA (aka Waaaaaaaahhhh!!) Gender: Male
Green Habit wrote:
Quote:
Lose 16 games, draft Locker, might reinvigorate the team.
Win 5 games, draft Luck, still might reinvigorate the team.
FTFY.
I know you're a Locker homer and would like to see him stay in Seattle from a fan's perspective, but there's always more than one way that a team can get better, and it doesn't always involve the first overall pick.
EDIT:
Bammer wrote:
And then watch Locker either...
A) Drift off into obscurity with the Raiders
This won't happen, since thankfully the Patriots have their first round pick.
Tim Lincecum wasn't the first pick...I'm saying don't pass on the hometown hero. Because if they do have success, it will be appreciated more. Let's say that Luck and Locker are absolutely even in EVERY aspect of their game. Let's say they will both go on to have the exact same winning percentage for their pro career. The Seahawks will benefit more by having Locker in a Seattle jersey rather than Luck. They just will. People here love him. In my experience there are a lot of Husky fans who could give two shits about the Seahawks...and they would become converts (myself included).
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:08 am Posts: 22978 Gender: Male
Bammer wrote:
Tim Lincecum wasn't the first pick...I'm saying don't pass on the hometown hero. Because if they do have success, it will be appreciated more. Let's say that Luck and Locker are absolutely even in EVERY aspect of their game. Let's say they will both go on to have the exact same winning percentage for their pro career. The Seahawks will benefit more by having Locker in a Seattle jersey rather than Luck. They just will. People here love him. In my experience there are a lot of Husky fans who could give two shits about the Seahawks...and they would become converts (myself included).
Thats impossible. There is no way they can be even in every aspect. And as it seems, there is enough pressure in being a top 5 QB pick. The added demands of playing in your home town just increase that. It also eliminates any opportunity for the coach to wait till mid season to start a guy.
the fact is, any QB who takes a moribund franchise and makes them a winner is going to be equally loved over time.
This thread sounds like bammer was drinking with some buddies on saturday.. and started talking about how the seahawks should lose all their games to get locker- and his buddies were like "dude, you dont even care about the hawks, shut up!"
Besides, this is a dumb year to even consider it, given that Mallett is probably better than locker anyways
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