Holy shit somebody was seriously suggesting Kessel for Schneider?!?!?
Anyone replacing Kessel will come within 25 points of Kessel. Maybe Lupul drops of 12 points and Bozak the same. That's 50 points and maybe 35-40 goals you lose. Getting Schneider in, even if his goals aganist goes up .25 a game and he plays 60 games, that saves the team 40 goals against. The Leafs stand a lot better chance making the playoffs and truly starting to turn things around with Schneider or other good goalie than they do with Kessel. See Nashville, Florida, etc.....
You're significantly downplaying just how good Kessel has been this year.
I like the Florida example too, since they solved their goaltending issues by... wait for it... signing a solid veteran to a short term deal to bridge the gap to their good young goalie who's not quite ready for a starting job in the NHL yet.
So now you've gone from "the best thing to do would be to pick up a cheap, veteran placeholder" to solid veteran (with significant playoff experience).
If Kessel is so good why isn't he having a greater impact on the club? Why are they so far down in the standings? Kessel can score, that's a given but he's also a horrible two way player hence he's a negative +/- player. Carlyle's system will help his defensive play but I have no doubt it will impact his point production and attitude.
I believe solid goatending will make a greater impact on their making the playoffs than having Kessel. But there's no reason to choose if you can pick up young (and so far pretty rock solid at the NHL level) for just a first rounder. Trading Kessel straight up for Schneider frees a lot of cap room where I'm quite certain you could sign a winger who'll net you 30 instead of Kessel's possible 40 while being more of a two way player, and it saves your vaunted first rounder.
Holy shit somebody was seriously suggesting Kessel for Schneider?!?!?
Anyone replacing Kessel will come within 25 points of Kessel. Maybe Lupul drops of 12 points and Bozak the same. That's 50 points and maybe 35-40 goals you lose. Getting Schneider in, even if his goals aganist goes up .25 a game and he plays 60 games, that saves the team 40 goals against. The Leafs stand a lot better chance making the playoffs and truly starting to turn things around with Schneider or other good goalie than they do with Kessel. See Nashville, Florida, etc.....
You're significantly downplaying just how good Kessel has been this year.
I like the Florida example too, since they solved their goaltending issues by... wait for it... signing a solid veteran to a short term deal to bridge the gap to their good young goalie who's not quite ready for a starting job in the NHL yet.
So now you've gone from "the best thing to do would be to pick up a cheap, veteran placeholder" to solid veteran (with significant playoff experience).
If Kessel is so good why isn't he having a greater impact on the club? Why are they so far down in the standings? Kessel can score, that's a given but he's also a horrible two way player hence he's a negative +/- player. Carlyle's system will help his defensive play but I have no doubt it will impact his point production and attitude.
I believe solid goatending will make a greater impact on their making the playoffs than having Kessel. But there's no reason to choose if you can pick up young (and so far pretty rock solid at the NHL level) for just a first rounder. Trading Kessel straight up for Schneider frees a lot of cap room where I'm quite certain you could sign a winger who'll net you 30 instead of Kessel's possible 40 while being more of a two way player, and it saves your vaunted first rounder.
Stamkos, Tavares, the list goes on. Why aren't they in the playoffs? Is it because they aren't "so good"? They even take faceoffs and can't win the game alone. +/- on a horrible team doesn't mean much. Flames have more than solid goaltending and they have slim chances of making playoffs. Games now won and lost by scoring. Kings would be even better this year of they had some scoring. They have top 5 goalie and still struggling to make playoffs until they jumped dallas last night. None of what you claim makes any sense.
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tyler wrote:
So now you've gone from "the best thing to do would be to pick up a cheap, veteran placeholder" to solid veteran (with significant playoff experience).
What? I didn't say it had to be a shitty veteran, I just said cheap. Like... Jose Theodore and his $1.5 million cap hit. Please explain to me how Theodore doesn't fit the description of "cheap, veteran placeholder." He fits perfectly into the description I gave.
tyler wrote:
If Kessel is so good why isn't he having a greater impact on the club? Why are they so far down in the standings? Kessel can score, that's a given but he's also a horrible two way player hence he's a negative +/- player. Carlyle's system will help his defensive play but I have no doubt it will impact his point production and attitude.
This is such a terrible argument. If Adam Oates was so good, why didn't he win the Cup? If Marcel Dionne was so good, why did his team miss the playoff when he had 121 points and a -15? If Pavel Bure was so good, why would he have been a -2 on a non-playoff team when he scored 59 goals? I wouldn't have thought I would have to be this explicit, but just in case: there are 20 players dressed for every game, and sometimes, despite having one really, really good player, the team just isn't that good. Phil Kessel is having a far greater impact on this team than you seem to realize, but they only have one of him and he can't play 60 minutes a night.
tyler wrote:
I believe solid goatending will make a greater impact on their making the playoffs than having Kessel. But there's no reason to choose if you can pick up young (and so far pretty rock solid at the NHL level) for just a first rounder. Trading Kessel straight up for Schneider frees a lot of cap room where I'm quite certain you could sign a winger who'll net you 30 instead of Kessel's possible 40 while being more of a two way player, and it saves your vaunted first rounder.
Tell me which wingers on the free agent market you're referring to, because I'm pretty sure there are only two of them, and I'm also pretty sure they're going to get a lot more than Kessel is making right now. And, again, it's not "just a first rounder." Right now we're talking about a top-5 pick. I don't know how many times I have to say this but... you just don't trade a top-5 pick for someone like Cory Schneider.
_________________ I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...
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EastHastings wrote:
Stamkos, Tavares, the list goes on. Why aren't they in the playoffs? Is it because they aren't "so good"? They even take faceoffs and can't win the game alone. +/- on a horrible team doesn't mean much. Flames have more than solid goaltending and they have slim chances of making playoffs. Games now won and lost by scoring. Kings would be even better this year of they had some scoring. They have top 5 goalie and still struggling to make playoffs until they jumped dallas last night. None of what you claim makes any sense.
That too.
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PhilPritchard wrote:
tyler wrote:
If Kessel is so good why isn't he having a greater impact on the club? Why are they so far down in the standings? Kessel can score, that's a given but he's also a horrible two way player hence he's a negative +/- player. Carlyle's system will help his defensive play but I have no doubt it will impact his point production and attitude.
This is such a terrible argument. If Adam Oates was so good, why didn't he win the Cup? If Marcel Dionne was so good, why did his team miss the playoff when he had 121 points and a -15? If Pavel Bure was so good, why would he have been a -2 on a non-playoff team when he scored 59 goals? I wouldn't have thought I would have to be this explicit, but just in case: there are 20 players dressed for every game, and sometimes, despite having one really, really good player, the team just isn't that good. Phil Kessel is having a far greater impact on this team than you seem to realize, but they only have one of him and he can't play 60 minutes a night.
Only because he's a pussy.
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given2trade wrote:
Oh, you think I'm being douchey? Well I shall have to re-examine everything then. Thanks brah.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:34 am Posts: 12700 Location: ...a town in north Ontario...
Mickey wrote:
Also when did Corey Schneider become the mythical secret-Jesus-goalie who will instantly save any team he starts for?
Yeah I think he's going to be a very good goalie, but people seem to be going overboard with how much he'll impact a team.
I still kind of have a suspicion he'll go to Tampa Bay. Maybe it's just because I would rather see the Leafs sign Harding as a UFA than make a trade for Schneider... I don't know. Either way, I think the UFA route is the way to go for both teams.
_________________ I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...
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Down Goes Brown's comment on Lupul's Masterton nomination sums up Phil Kessel perfectly:
Quote:
Joffrey Lupul, Toronto Maple Leafs - Was somehow able to post the best offensive season of his career despite the overwhelming disadvantage of being stuck with a linemate who occasionally doesn't feel like talking to the media.
_________________ I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...
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EllisEamos wrote:
oh, i forgot i guess... what w/ all the high picks the Bs have had lately.
Hey, what happened to this?
EllisEamos wrote:
i'm not piling on.
y'all are in a bad place these days.
Watching Sportsnet right now is hilarious. Until today, everyone in the media was so mad at everything about the Leafs. After tonight's game they're all being very... consoling. They have a very "Sorry about your loss" attitude instead of the anger they usually display.
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PhilPritchard wrote:
EllisEamos wrote:
oh, i forgot i guess... what w/ all the high picks the Bs have had lately.
Hey, what happened to this?
EllisEamos wrote:
i'm not piling on.
y'all are in a bad place these days.
Watching Sportsnet right now is hilarious. Until today, everyone in the media was so mad at everything about the Leafs. After tonight's game they're all being very... consoling. They have a very "Sorry about your loss" attitude instead of the anger they usually display.
wasn't that last week? i figured since its all but officially over, y'all could take it.
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