Board index » Word on the Street... » Sports




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 1776 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 84, 85, 86, 87, 88, 89  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:22 pm 
Offline
User avatar
Supersonic
 Profile

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:34 am
Posts: 12700
Location: ...a town in north Ontario...
mick7184 wrote:
It's not stupid at all, if he was so fucking fantastic he wouldnt have been traded 4 times before he hit age 30.


Jose Bautista was left unprotected in the Rule 5 draft, waived twice, traded for Justin Huber, used as a throw-in in another trade, and traded for Robinson Diaz before he turned 28. David Ortiz was used as a PTBNL in a trade for Dave Hollins and was later released by the Minnesota Twins. Pedro Martinez was traded twice before he turned 26. I guess the Dodgers and Expos knew there was something wrong with him.

mick7184 wrote:
The Marlins traded him for Ugeth Urbina, who was a good closer, but you dont trade a player you think is going to be a franchise player just to get a good closer for the stretch run.


Gonzalez was a valuable young player who was used to bring in a closer to help push the team over the top. Oddly enough, it did get them over the top and helped them win the World Series that year.

mick7184 wrote:
The Rangers traded him for a medicore starter and a decent reliever


When the Rangers made that trade they had horrendous pitching and Mark Teixeira at first. They didn't trade Gonzalez because of some character issues; they traded him because he was a redundant asset and they had other positions of need.

mick7184 wrote:
After a season in which he completely fell apart in the second half and disappeared as his team was spinning down the drain to a historic collapse


I'm pretty sure I already mentioned it, but Gonzalez had a huge September in 2011. Say what you will about comments he made to the media, but David Ortiz and Kevin Youkilis disappeared during the callapse... Gonzalez improved.

_________________
I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:31 pm 
Offline
User avatar
Unthought Known
 Profile

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:24 pm
Posts: 6501
Location: Massachusetts
Gender: Male
PhilPritchard wrote:
mick7184 wrote:
It's not stupid at all, if he was so fucking fantastic he wouldnt have been traded 4 times before he hit age 30.


PhilPritchard wrote:
Jose Bautista was left unprotected in the Rule 5 draft, waived twice, traded for Justin Huber, used as a throw-in in another trade, and traded for Robinson Diaz before he turned 28. David Ortiz was used as a PTBNL in a trade for Dave Hollins and was later released by the Minnesota Twins. Pedro Martinez was traded twice before he turned 26. I guess the Dodgers and Expos knew there was something wrong with him.


All of those players were guys who were late bloomers and surprised all of baseball, Gonzalez was the number 1 pick in the draft.

mick7184 wrote:
The Marlins traded him for Ugeth Urbina, who was a good closer, but you dont trade a player you think is going to be a franchise player just to get a good closer for the stretch run.


PhilPritchard wrote:
Gonzalez was a valuable young player who was used to bring in a closer to help push the team over the top. Oddly enough, it did get them over the top and helped them win the World Series that year.


Again, Gonzalez was the #1 pick in the draft, not a mere "valuable young player."

mick7184 wrote:
The Rangers traded him for a medicore starter and a decent reliever


PhilPritchard wrote:
When the Rangers made that trade they had horrendous pitching and Mark Teixeira at first. They didn't trade Gonzalez because of some character issues; they traded him because he was a redundant asset and they had other positions of need.


Fine, they traded from a position of strength to fill a need, but Gonzalez was the one they let go, not Teixeira, even though Teixeira was to hit free agency sooner and was represented by Scott Boras.

mick7184 wrote:
After a season in which he completely fell apart in the second half and disappeared as his team was spinning down the drain to a historic collapse


PhilPritchard wrote:
I'm pretty sure I already mentioned it, but Gonzalez had a huge September in 2011. Say what you will about comments he made to the media, but David Ortiz and Kevin Youkilis disappeared during the callapse... Gonzalez improved.


This is misleading at best, Ortiz and Youkilis were both hurt down the stretch run, and Gonzalez did not have a huge September 2011, he was completely useless that entire month, and anyone who watched this team daily that year knows that.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:14 am 
Offline
User avatar
Supersonic
 Profile

Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 3:04 am
Posts: 12383
Gender: Male
mick...I disagree with you 100 percent, so I'm not going to belabor the point here.

RA Dickey...man, the Jays are having a nifty little off-season.

_________________
RIP Mr. Dirty Frank


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:10 am 
Offline
User avatar
Supersonic
 Profile

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:34 am
Posts: 12700
Location: ...a town in north Ontario...
mick7184 wrote:
This is misleading at best, Ortiz and Youkilis were both hurt down the stretch run, and Gonzalez did not have a huge September 2011, he was completely useless that entire month, and anyone who watched this team daily that year knows that.


He had a .977 OPS in September. That's huge. I think your expectations might be a bit too high if you consider that "completely useless."

_________________
I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:14 am 
Offline
User avatar
Supersonic
 Profile

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:34 am
Posts: 12700
Location: ...a town in north Ontario...
Coach wrote:
mick...I disagree with you 100 percent, so I'm not going to belabor the point here.

RA Dickey...man, the Jays are having a nifty little off-season.


I'm becoming more and more at peace with the price the Jays paid to get Dickey. They have a bunch of great players on good contracts in the prime of their careers... might as well go for it now.

_________________
I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:48 pm 
Offline
User avatar
Supersonic
 Profile

Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 3:04 am
Posts: 12383
Gender: Male
PhilPritchard wrote:
Coach wrote:
mick...I disagree with you 100 percent, so I'm not going to belabor the point here.

RA Dickey...man, the Jays are having a nifty little off-season.


I'm becoming more and more at peace with the price the Jays paid to get Dickey. They have a bunch of great players on good contracts in the prime of their careers... might as well go for it now.


of course! especially with the yanks, sox down.

_________________
RIP Mr. Dirty Frank


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar
Reissued
 Profile

Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:41 pm
Posts: 23014
Location: NOT FLO-RIDIN
Gender: Male
Yeah I agreed with your post the other day, Phil. Dickey, to me, is high-risk, high-reward. He might completely tank (AL East line-ups), but a knuckleballer is way less hampered by age than anyone else and he pitched consistently well last year to the extent that you wouldn't really call it a fluke. And I think it is really similar to the Royals trade, except the Jays already have the parts in-place to make a run. The Rays look like their toughest competition (Baltimore can't sustain the insane luck they had last year--the split between their expected run total based on sabermetrics and their actual run totals was insane) and they already had some talent there. Should be interesting.

_________________
given2trade wrote:
Oh, you think I'm being douchey? Well I shall have to re-examine everything then. Thanks brah.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:35 pm 
Offline
User avatar
Got Some
 YIM  Profile

Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 10:21 am
Posts: 1909
Location: The Jungle
Gotta love the Jays and O's going for it knowing the Yanks and Sox are kinda at odd points
Just hope they dont mortgage the next 10 years for 1 or 2 years ala the Marlins...

_________________
I am the king of the Jungle, they call me Tigerman


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:28 am 
Offline
User avatar
a joke
 Profile

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:08 am
Posts: 22978
Gender: Male
What exactly are the O's doing to "go for it?"


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:13 am 
Offline
User avatar
Supersonic
 Profile

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:34 am
Posts: 12700
Location: ...a town in north Ontario...
Skitch Patterson wrote:
What exactly are the O's doing to "go for it?"


They re-signed Nate McLouth!

I don't feel like the Jays have mortgaged the future at all. They still have a decent enough system, and Anthopoulos put the current system together in 3 years. Now they have three years where they should be really good while he builds it back up again. Obviously that's kind of an ideal situation, but it makes sense.

_________________
I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:37 pm 
Offline
User avatar
Unthought Known
 Profile

Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 12:47 pm
Posts: 9282
Location: Atlanta
Gender: Male
I don't know how good the catcher the Ray's gave up will be, but I like Josh Thole. I think he's a solid MLB catcher.

_________________
Attention Phenylketonurics: Contains Phenylalanine


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:04 pm 
Offline
User avatar
a joke
 Profile

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:08 am
Posts: 22978
Gender: Male
PhilPritchard wrote:
Skitch Patterson wrote:
What exactly are the O's doing to "go for it?"


They re-signed Nate McLouth!

I don't feel like the Jays have mortgaged the future at all. They still have a decent enough system, and Anthopoulos put the current system together in 3 years. Now they have three years where they should be really good while he builds it back up again. Obviously that's kind of an ideal situation, but it makes sense.



Yeah. Him bringing up the O's just baffled me. They are doing the smart thing, for their situation. They know last year was flukey, so instead of trying to make the "win now" move, they are going to continue to let their players develop, and go from there. I just think they should deal JJ Hardy to let Machado play short.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:44 pm 
Offline
User avatar
Supersonic
 Profile

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:34 am
Posts: 12700
Location: ...a town in north Ontario...
Electromatic wrote:
I don't know how good the catcher the Ray's gave up will be, but I like Josh Thole. I think he's a solid MLB catcher.


I think I like Thole too. He put up some OK numbers before last year... he obviously has no power, but before last season his career OBP was .350. That's pretty awesome for a backup catcher.

_________________
I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:05 am 
Offline
User avatar
Red Mosquito, my libido
 Profile

Joined: Sun May 21, 2006 2:02 am
Posts: 91597
Location: Sector 7-G
I am ready to concede Theo may not be a genius.

_________________
It takes a big man to make a threat on the internet.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:05 am 
Offline
User avatar
Got Some
 YIM  Profile

Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 10:21 am
Posts: 1909
Location: The Jungle
With the O's it wasnt so much moves, as much as it was team wide saying hey, we can do it this year, lets go. If they were say, the Pirates theyd have already traded away Hardy, and if they were the Marlins theyd have traded Hardy and Machado...

_________________
I am the king of the Jungle, they call me Tigerman


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:08 am 
Offline
User avatar
Red Mosquito, my libido
 Profile

Joined: Sun May 21, 2006 2:02 am
Posts: 91597
Location: Sector 7-G
MadTIGERmaN wrote:
With the O's it wasnt so much moves, as much as it was team wide saying hey, we can do it this year, lets go. If they were say, the Pirates theyd have already traded away Hardy, and if they were the Marlins theyd have traded Hardy and Machado...



Why would they trade a league minimum guy with 6 years of Club control?

_________________
It takes a big man to make a threat on the internet.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:32 am 
Offline
User avatar
Supersonic
 Profile

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:34 am
Posts: 12700
Location: ...a town in north Ontario...
I would be pretty shocked if the Orioles don't finish last in the division this year.

_________________
I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:29 am 
Offline
User avatar
Reissued
 Profile

Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:41 pm
Posts: 23014
Location: NOT FLO-RIDIN
Gender: Male
Wait, really? I think there's a chance the O's finish last, sure--they had so many things go right for them that will be hard to repeat--but I think between Boston's rotation and NY's infield, there's no reason to think the O's are destined for the basement (to not even speak of the questions about the Jays, the Rays, or the Os ability to improve from within).

_________________
given2trade wrote:
Oh, you think I'm being douchey? Well I shall have to re-examine everything then. Thanks brah.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:39 pm 
Offline
User avatar
Supersonic
 Profile

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:34 am
Posts: 12700
Location: ...a town in north Ontario...
Mickey wrote:
Wait, really? I think there's a chance the O's finish last, sure--they had so many things go right for them that will be hard to repeat--but I think between Boston's rotation and NY's infield, there's no reason to think the O's are destined for the basement (to not even speak of the questions about the Jays, the Rays, or the Os ability to improve from within).


I see the Jays being a lot better, the Sox being better, the Rays staying the same and the Yankees falling back a bit... but I still don't see them falling off as far as the O's. They've got some good young players in place, but it really did take a lot of things breaking right for them, including a ton of luck all season, for them to put up the record they did last year. I just can't see that trend keeping up for another season.

_________________
I think we relinquished enough... and it's still dark enough... and it goes on and on and on...


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: 2012 MLB Thread
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 3:45 am 
Offline
User avatar
Got Some
 YIM  Profile

Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 10:21 am
Posts: 1909
Location: The Jungle
cutuphalfdead wrote:
MadTIGERmaN wrote:
With the O's it wasnt so much moves, as much as it was team wide saying hey, we can do it this year, lets go. If they were say, the Pirates theyd have already traded away Hardy, and if they were the Marlins theyd have traded Hardy and Machado...



Why would they trade a league minimum guy with 6 years of Club control?


Was being sarcastic saying the Marlins and Pirates trade off young talent for more young talent before ever seeing if young talent will gel lol

_________________
I am the king of the Jungle, they call me Tigerman


Top
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 1776 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 84, 85, 86, 87, 88, 89  Next

Board index » Word on the Street... » Sports


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
It is currently Mon Oct 23, 2017 10:39 pm