Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 1:09 am
too drunk to moderate properly
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:19 pm Posts: 39068 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA Gender: Male
I might go for the single-disc Gish.
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
Pearl Jam shows: Champaign 4/23/2003 Chicago 6/18/2003 St. Louis 10/05/2004 Portland 7/20/2006 Gorge 7/22/2006 Ridgefield 9/26/2009 Philadelphia 10/31/2009
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:22 am
Yeah Yeah Yeah
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:37 am Posts: 3819
Based on the stuff that made the Ten and Vs. reissues, I'm glad they haven't done it. I'm happy to have that acoustic "Hold On," but tracks like "2000 Mile Blues," "Goat," "Cready Stomp," and those "SOLAT" and "Breath" demos belong on bootlegs.
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 10:42 pm
Force of Nature
Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2005 3:49 am Posts: 306
Kevin Davis wrote:
Based on the stuff that made the Ten and Vs. reissues, I'm glad they haven't done it. I'm happy to have that acoustic "Hold On," but tracks like "2000 Mile Blues," "Goat," "Cready Stomp," and those "SOLAT" and "Breath" demos belong on bootlegs.
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 1:11 am
Force of Nature
Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2004 6:26 pm Posts: 925 Location: San Antonio, TX Gender: Male
Just bought the Gish deluxe edition(and at a good deal too: $26 @ Best Buy). Pretty neat package. I havent listened to the bonus disc yet but the actual album does sound BETTER than i remember. Cant wait to watch the DVD later!
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 6:15 am
Got Some
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 10:12 pm Posts: 1749 Location: Portland, OR
Kevin Davis wrote:
Based on the stuff that made the Ten and Vs. reissues, I'm glad they haven't done it. I'm happy to have that acoustic "Hold On," but tracks like "2000 Mile Blues," "Goat," "Cready Stomp," and those "SOLAT" and "Breath" demos belong on bootlegs.
I'm sure they have better material, I just think they're too lazy to dig it up. They probably spend a few minutes thinking over what they left off the albums, then have somebody go dig it up. The thought of rehearsal demos, alternate mixes and live cuts is probably too much work for them.
The difference here is that Billy Corgan is an obsessive nut when it comes to his band's legacy. He recorded EVERYTHING. One thing to note about the reissues is that very little of the bonus discs have been bootlegged before, since he knows perfectly well what the fans already have. A lot of people believe he lurks on fan message boards as well. He knows what fans want. I don't think Pearl Jam has the slightest clue what we want.
Pearl Jam shows: Champaign 4/23/2003 Chicago 6/18/2003 St. Louis 10/05/2004 Portland 7/20/2006 Gorge 7/22/2006 Ridgefield 9/26/2009 Philadelphia 10/31/2009
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 7:00 pm
Yeah Yeah Yeah
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:37 am Posts: 3819
matt reeder wrote:
Kevin Davis wrote:
Based on the stuff that made the Ten and Vs. reissues, I'm glad they haven't done it. I'm happy to have that acoustic "Hold On," but tracks like "2000 Mile Blues," "Goat," "Cready Stomp," and those "SOLAT" and "Breath" demos belong on bootlegs.
I'm sure they have better material, I just think they're too lazy to dig it up. They probably spend a few minutes thinking over what they left off the albums, then have somebody go dig it up. The thought of rehearsal demos, alternate mixes and live cuts is probably too much work for them.
The difference here is that Billy Corgan is an obsessive nut when it comes to his band's legacy. He recorded EVERYTHING. One thing to note about the reissues is that very little of the bonus discs have been bootlegged before, since he knows perfectly well what the fans already have. A lot of people believe he lurks on fan message boards as well. He knows what fans want. I don't think Pearl Jam has the slightest clue what we want.
What more would you have Pearl Jam do? And how are you "sure" that they have "better material" that they're just "too lazy" to dig up?
I think the accusation of Pearl Jam being "lazy" is probably the thing I'm most tired of reading on this board. Seriously, what legitimate grounds do you have for saying something like that, other than the fact that they haven't managed to put out the one type of product you want?
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 7:52 pm
too drunk to moderate properly
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:19 pm Posts: 39068 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA Gender: Male
Kevin's right.
That said, I think I'm going to see if I get Siamese Dream and/or Gish for Christmas before I go get 'em. I hope the Amazon price stays low.
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:03 pm
Master of Meh
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 11:00 pm Posts: 13226 Location: Adelaide, AUS
Well, there are quite a lot of songs that we already know about that could've fleshed out the Ten boxset quite nicely. A lot of them are already available to the fan community, but it would have been nice to collate them in one place and in (hopefully) improved quality.
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 9:51 pm
Yeah Yeah Yeah
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:37 am Posts: 3819
spenno wrote:
Well, there are quite a lot of songs that we already know about that could've fleshed out the Ten boxset quite nicely. A lot of them are already available to the fan community, but it would have been nice to collate them in one place and in (hopefully) improved quality.
I think it's just presumptuous, this idea that not including those things automatically amounts to "laziness."
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 9:56 pm
Master of Meh
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 11:00 pm Posts: 13226 Location: Adelaide, AUS
Kevin Davis wrote:
spenno wrote:
Well, there are quite a lot of songs that we already know about that could've fleshed out the Ten boxset quite nicely. A lot of them are already available to the fan community, but it would have been nice to collate them in one place and in (hopefully) improved quality.
I think it's just presumptuous, this idea that not including those things automatically amounts to "laziness."
Oh, sure. I don't think I used that word, I think it's more likely that they weren't aiming for the kind of exhaustive release that I would've preferred.
Anyway, the Smashing Pumpkins reissues sound great and Billy's chosen some excellent bonus tracks. Good stuff.
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 6:26 am
Got Some
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 10:12 pm Posts: 1749 Location: Portland, OR
Kevin Davis wrote:
matt reeder wrote:
Kevin Davis wrote:
Based on the stuff that made the Ten and Vs. reissues, I'm glad they haven't done it. I'm happy to have that acoustic "Hold On," but tracks like "2000 Mile Blues," "Goat," "Cready Stomp," and those "SOLAT" and "Breath" demos belong on bootlegs.
I'm sure they have better material, I just think they're too lazy to dig it up. They probably spend a few minutes thinking over what they left off the albums, then have somebody go dig it up. The thought of rehearsal demos, alternate mixes and live cuts is probably too much work for them.
The difference here is that Billy Corgan is an obsessive nut when it comes to his band's legacy. He recorded EVERYTHING. One thing to note about the reissues is that very little of the bonus discs have been bootlegged before, since he knows perfectly well what the fans already have. A lot of people believe he lurks on fan message boards as well. He knows what fans want. I don't think Pearl Jam has the slightest clue what we want.
What more would you have Pearl Jam do? And how are you "sure" that they have "better material" that they're just "too lazy" to dig up?
I think the accusation of Pearl Jam being "lazy" is probably the thing I'm most tired of reading on this board. Seriously, what legitimate grounds do you have for saying something like that, other than the fact that they haven't managed to put out the one type of product you want?
So they bothered to reissue Vs. and Vitalogy and could only manage to find three bonus tracks each that were worthy of being included on the reissue? I realize we didn't have any of the 6 but still, 3 tracks per album? They couldn't bother to look for a demo or something that might shed more light on the creation of the album, or maybe some key live tracks, or an attempt at a song that would end up on a later album? Or even to put the b-sides from that album not on Lost Dogs in one place? Hell, they couldn't even bother to include the Chicago Cab version of "Hard to Imagine" on the Vitalogy reissue.
It's pretty weak. Maybe I'm just used to quality reissues, like the Pavement reissue series, the three Sonic Youth reissues or these new Smashing Pumpkins reissues, or any of the other ones I've seen recently.
Incidentally, I pre-ordered these reissues from the SP website and still haven't received them. The company they contracted completely screwed up the order for everyone. Next time I'll just buy it at the local record store.
Pearl Jam shows: Champaign 4/23/2003 Chicago 6/18/2003 St. Louis 10/05/2004 Portland 7/20/2006 Gorge 7/22/2006 Ridgefield 9/26/2009 Philadelphia 10/31/2009
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:00 pm
Yeah Yeah Yeah
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:37 am Posts: 3819
matt reeder wrote:
or maybe some key live tracks
They did unearth key live tracks; there was an entire CD of them, called "Live at the Orpheum," included in the very affordable 3CD set.
It just sounds like you didn't get exactly what you wanted, so in turn you're blaming it on the band being "lazy." How do you have any idea? Maybe the reissue you wanted just wasn't what they wanted to release? It seems like everything from the bootleg program (seriously, how much more fan-friendly does a group need to be than do offer something like this?) to the whole PJ20 spectacle (weekend, film, book, CD) to numerous other things they've done over the years amounts, finally, to a band that is extremely fan-conscious--this despite the number of people who are as sure as you are of their laziness that the only reason they do any of these things is to bleed our bank accounts dry.
Post subject: Re: Smashing Pumpkins to reissue Gish and Siamese Dream 11/29/11
Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:56 pm
Got Some
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 10:12 pm Posts: 1749 Location: Portland, OR
Kevin Davis wrote:
matt reeder wrote:
or maybe some key live tracks
They did unearth key live tracks; there was an entire CD of them, called "Live at the Orpheum," included in the very affordable 3CD set.
It just sounds like you didn't get exactly what you wanted, so in turn you're blaming it on the band being "lazy." How do you have any idea? Maybe the reissue you wanted just wasn't what they wanted to release? It seems like everything from the bootleg program (seriously, how much more fan-friendly does a group need to be than do offer something like this?) to the whole PJ20 spectacle (weekend, film, book, CD) to numerous other things they've done over the years amounts, finally, to a band that is extremely fan-conscious--this despite the number of people who are as sure as you are of their laziness that the only reason they do any of these things is to bleed our bank accounts dry.
I accept that they didn't want to release the kind of reissue I would prefer, but I would offer that it comes from an unwillingness to go through their archives. Either they aren't prolific and released the only things we haven't heard that are listenable, or they just didn't try. Why even bother reissuing an album when you have nothing to add to it?
Don't even get me started on the live disc. Why bother releasing a recording of a historically great show when you can't even put out the most complete recording you have of it? It doesn't make any sense to me.
I think the band thinks they are being self-conscious. I just think they are failing.
The Smashing Pumpkins reissues are some of the best I've seen, though the Pavement reissues are pretty insane too. For example, here is the Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain reissue. Awesome.
Pearl Jam shows: Champaign 4/23/2003 Chicago 6/18/2003 St. Louis 10/05/2004 Portland 7/20/2006 Gorge 7/22/2006 Ridgefield 9/26/2009 Philadelphia 10/31/2009
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 16 guests
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot post attachments in this forum