I was curious to hear what people thought about this. To me its divine.
Story goes that a poor man named Juan Diego in 1531 was visited by the Virgin Mary, and she told him to tell the head priest to build a temple in the spot they were located. The priest didn't believe him and he went back to the spot where the Virgin visited him again, and she told Diego to pick the roses at the top of the hill and carry them in his cloak. It was December and roses weren't in season. He carries them to the priest and drops the roses right in front of him, and on the cloak revealed a magical painting of the Virgin Mary.
Now a lot of skeptics denounce that story, but one thing they avoid to talk about, because they can't explain it. The cloak and painting are in a chapel in Mexico City today, and is visited by worshipers all of the world. Heres the kicker. The painting itself is in perfect condition and its been nearly 500 years. Scientists are baffled because of what the cloak is made out of. It is made out of a cactus material, and any other painting painted on the cloth would ruin within 20 years. Over the years painters have added rays of light around the Virgin, and those rays of light cracked and ruined within a few years, but the Virgin stays perfect.
They also used some sort of imaging to look under the painting and had seen no underlying sketch. in the 1500s, sketches were always done before the artist started painting. Even today, it is rare for an artist to paint without a doing a sketch first.
Skeptics will question if Diego and the story are real, but what they cannot side step is the fact that the painting is something out of the ordinary.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:01 am Posts: 19477 Location: Brooklyn NY
Yeah, and I suppose if a picture of a Wiccan ritual materialized in the Smithsonian you'd probably be pretty skeptical though, wouldn't you?
Why do people believe in crap like this anyway? Oh that's right, because they continue to blindly listen to the people that tell them what to believe in. Its a legend, it isn't reality. There is no "mystery" involved, public miracles have been debunked by scientists and historians for decades if not centuries. You're believing in fairy tales, man. Believe in a God or believe in Christianity but don't believe an some ridiculous theological oral tradition. It has about as much reality as 40 Virgins for dead suicide bombers. Not to mention it happened some 500 years ago. Saying "science can't explain it," especially with regards to miracles that can be immediately attributed to the God of Christians is cynical and careless.
Legends like this were invented by the Spanish, the Conquistadors, and their accompanying priests to convert the natives.
Yeah, and I suppose if a picture of a Wiccan ritual materialized in the Smithsonian you'd probably be pretty skeptical though, wouldn't you?
Why do people believe in crap like this anyway? Oh that's right, because they continue to blindly listen to the people that tell them what to believe in. Its a legend, it isn't reality. There is no "mystery" involved, public miracles have been debunked by scientists and historians for decades if not centuries. You're believing in fairy tales, man. Believe in a God or believe in Christianity but don't believe an some ridiculous theological oral tradition. It has about as much reality as 40 Virgins for dead suicide bombers. Not to mention it happened some 500 years ago. Saying "science can't explain it," especially with regards to miracles that can be immediately attributed to the God of Christians is cynical and careless.
Legends like this were invented by the Spanish, the Conquistadors, and their accompanying priests to convert the natives.
Let me repeat this...skeptics went against the whole Juan Diego story. Thats fine by me, but you can't side step the actual painting thats in mexico. Scientists didn't debunk this "fairy tale" as you like to call it.
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:15 pm Posts: 25452 Location: Under my wing like Sanford & Son Gender: Male
I personally wish there were more legends to believe in. I'm as rational as the next guy, but there's something to be said for the mystical. I don't blame you for being interested in this at all.
_________________ Now that god no longer exists, the desire for another world still remains.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:01 am Posts: 19477 Location: Brooklyn NY
So what about the science? Link? The science proves nothing. It doesn't prove it is a miracle, it doesn't prove the existence of the divine, it doesn't prove the Virgin appeared to some converted Indian peasant...it looks like a painting that's been somewhat preserved and that's it. It's an icon and people have a right to hold it highly but the story behind it is based purely in centuries of oral tradition. The Buddhists, the Jews, the Muslims, the Hindus, the Christians, all have their own stories but that doesn't make any of them actually real.
Well all I'm saying dude is that its quite a mystery. The fact that this painting was supposed to start deteriorating over 400 years ago and its in perfect condition is quite astonishing.
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 2:29 pm Posts: 6217 Location: Evil Bunny Land
I really love this story.
I also like the legend of Our Lady of Fatima.
The Blessed Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, appeared 6 times to 3 sheperd children; Lucia, Francisco, and Jacinta; between May 13 and October 13, 1917. She came to the little village of Fatima which had remained faithful to the Catholic Church during the recent persecutions by the government. Our Lady came with a message from God to every man, woman, and child of our century. Our Lady of Fatima promised that the whole world would be in peace, and that many souls would go to Heaven if Her requests were listened to and obeyed. She told us that war is a punishment for sin; that God would punish the world for its sins in our time by means of war, hunger, persecution of the Church and persecution of the Holy Father, the Pope, unless we listened to and obeyed the command of God.
THE MIRACLE
As a great sign of the whole message truly coming from God, a marvelous miracle was worked in the sky above Fatima before 70,000 witnesses on October 13, 1917 at the time, date and place that Lucy and the other two children had prophesised in the name of Our Lady of Fatima. The children were told by Our Lady that God would perform a miracle so that people would believe in the apparitions. The date the children was October 13, 1917, in Fatima. On that date, 70,000 people came to see the phenomenon. The miracle occured with the sun. All could stare perfectly at the sun without blinking, or even hurting heir eyes. While all were watching the sun, it rotated, got large and small, got close to the people, and got far away from them. The sun " danced ". Every single person who was there testified to seeing the sun dance, even non- believers who immediately dropped onto their knees and begged for forgiveness.
You can find quite a few of the eyewitness accounts of that phenomenon.
_________________ “Some things have got to be believed to be seen.”
- Ralph Hodgson
The Blessed Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, appeared 6 times to 3 sheperd children; Lucia, Francisco, and Jacinta; between May 13 and October 13, 1917. She came to the little village of Fatima which had remained faithful to the Catholic Church during the recent persecutions by the government. Our Lady came with a message from God to every man, woman, and child of our century. Our Lady of Fatima promised that the whole world would be in peace, and that many souls would go to Heaven if Her requests were listened to and obeyed. She told us that war is a punishment for sin; that God would punish the world for its sins in our time by means of war, hunger, persecution of the Church and persecution of the Holy Father, the Pope, unless we listened to and obeyed the command of God.
THE MIRACLE
As a great sign of the whole message truly coming from God, a marvelous miracle was worked in the sky above Fatima before 70,000 witnesses on October 13, 1917 at the time, date and place that Lucy and the other two children had prophesised in the name of Our Lady of Fatima. The children were told by Our Lady that God would perform a miracle so that people would believe in the apparitions. The date the children was October 13, 1917, in Fatima. On that date, 70,000 people came to see the phenomenon. The miracle occured with the sun. All could stare perfectly at the sun without blinking, or even hurting heir eyes. While all were watching the sun, it rotated, got large and small, got close to the people, and got far away from them. The sun " danced ". Every single person who was there testified to seeing the sun dance, even non- believers who immediately dropped onto their knees and begged for forgiveness.
You can find quite a few of the eyewitness accounts of that phenomenon.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:14 am Posts: 37778 Location: OmaGOD!!! Gender: Male
I Hail Randy Moss wrote:
Gimme Some Skin wrote:
I really love this story.
I also like the legend of Our Lady of Fatima.
The Blessed Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, appeared 6 times to 3 sheperd children; Lucia, Francisco, and Jacinta; between May 13 and October 13, 1917. She came to the little village of Fatima which had remained faithful to the Catholic Church during the recent persecutions by the government. Our Lady came with a message from God to every man, woman, and child of our century. Our Lady of Fatima promised that the whole world would be in peace, and that many souls would go to Heaven if Her requests were listened to and obeyed. She told us that war is a punishment for sin; that God would punish the world for its sins in our time by means of war, hunger, persecution of the Church and persecution of the Holy Father, the Pope, unless we listened to and obeyed the command of God.
THE MIRACLE
As a great sign of the whole message truly coming from God, a marvelous miracle was worked in the sky above Fatima before 70,000 witnesses on October 13, 1917 at the time, date and place that Lucy and the other two children had prophesised in the name of Our Lady of Fatima. The children were told by Our Lady that God would perform a miracle so that people would believe in the apparitions. The date the children was October 13, 1917, in Fatima. On that date, 70,000 people came to see the phenomenon. The miracle occured with the sun. All could stare perfectly at the sun without blinking, or even hurting heir eyes. While all were watching the sun, it rotated, got large and small, got close to the people, and got far away from them. The sun " danced ". Every single person who was there testified to seeing the sun dance, even non- believers who immediately dropped onto their knees and begged for forgiveness.
You can find quite a few of the eyewitness accounts of that phenomenon.
I also like that one
Stories are fun.
_________________ Unfortunately, at the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius, the Flower Children jerked off and went back to sleep.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 12:47 am Posts: 46000 Location: Reasonville
punkdavid wrote:
I Hail Randy Moss wrote:
Gimme Some Skin wrote:
I really love this story.
I also like the legend of Our Lady of Fatima.
The Blessed Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, appeared 6 times to 3 sheperd children; Lucia, Francisco, and Jacinta; between May 13 and October 13, 1917. She came to the little village of Fatima which had remained faithful to the Catholic Church during the recent persecutions by the government. Our Lady came with a message from God to every man, woman, and child of our century. Our Lady of Fatima promised that the whole world would be in peace, and that many souls would go to Heaven if Her requests were listened to and obeyed. She told us that war is a punishment for sin; that God would punish the world for its sins in our time by means of war, hunger, persecution of the Church and persecution of the Holy Father, the Pope, unless we listened to and obeyed the command of God.
THE MIRACLE
As a great sign of the whole message truly coming from God, a marvelous miracle was worked in the sky above Fatima before 70,000 witnesses on October 13, 1917 at the time, date and place that Lucy and the other two children had prophesised in the name of Our Lady of Fatima. The children were told by Our Lady that God would perform a miracle so that people would believe in the apparitions. The date the children was October 13, 1917, in Fatima. On that date, 70,000 people came to see the phenomenon. The miracle occured with the sun. All could stare perfectly at the sun without blinking, or even hurting heir eyes. While all were watching the sun, it rotated, got large and small, got close to the people, and got far away from them. The sun " danced ". Every single person who was there testified to seeing the sun dance, even non- believers who immediately dropped onto their knees and begged for forgiveness.
You can find quite a few of the eyewitness accounts of that phenomenon.
I also like that one
Stories are fun.
i like that story...what's it called...
oh, 'the bible,' right.
_________________ No matter how dark the storm gets overhead They say someone's watching from the calm at the edge What about us when we're down here in it? We gotta watch our backs
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:19 pm Posts: 39068 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA Gender: Male
MARY ON TOAST!
you unbelieving bitches!!!
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
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