My young son and I were talking last week about the definition of a lie. As a nine-year-old, he's expanding his boundaries and testing the waters on how little he can get away with telling my wife and me without crossing the line into being a liar. This seems to me like a perfectly normal part of childhood development so, as we talked, I used an example from last winter, when we had a misunderstanding about whether or not his school had been closed in advance of a monster snowstorm.
He told me the night before that he heard from one of the teachers that, because of the magnitude of the expected storm, classes had been called off in advance for the next day. We found out later that night that this information was incorrect, that a preemptive snow-day had not been called and my little boy promptly apologized for "lying."
I asked at the time if he knew that a snow-day had really not been called and, when he replied that he really did believe his information was correct, I explained that he had simply been mistaken and that he had not lied. If he had found out at 6:00 PM that his information was wrong, I said to him, telling me at 7:00 PM that school had already been canceled would indeed have been a lie.
My little boy understands and acknowledges that obvious distinction -- Republicans do not.
As if we need more evidence of this, Republican National Committee Chairman Ken Mehlman sent out an e-mail blast yesterday lashing John Kerry for allegedly insulting America's military personnel.
"Listen closely this election season and you'll hear the truth about what Democrats represent," wrote Mehlman. "Monday, failed Presidential candidate John Kerry brazenly insulted the brave American men and women serving in our military. In Kerry's cocoon of privilege, those who serve in our military are failures who never did their homework or 'made an effort to be smart.'"
"Our troops deserve to be honored, not insulted by the likes of John Kerry."
Mehlman ended his deceptive pitch by getting down to brass tacks and saying "We need you now to keep the John Kerry Democrats out of power."
By any sensible person's definition -- and what an average grade-school child would understand -- is that this was a lie. Ken Mehlman knew when he released this e-mail that John Kerry had not "brazenly insulted the brave American men and women serving in our military." He knew from a comparison of the prepared text and how Kerry bungled the joke he intended to tell that it was meant for Mehlman's master, George W. Bush, and not the troops in Iraq and that there was certainly nothing brazen about it.
He knew all of that as a matter of fact, in addition to knowing that, unlike the vast majority of the Republican leadership, John Kerry is a highly-decorated Veteran, who has always fought for America's Vets and active-duty military and would never lob such disrespect their way.
But Mehlman said it anyway. He knew at 1:00 PM that what he was writing was a lie. But he sent the e-mail at 2:00 PM anyway.
George W. Bush did the same thing in a speech after Kerry made his remarks but well after the truth of the Massachusetts Senator's intent was known -- he bashed Kerry, knowing it would be all over the world on nightly newscasts and also knowing that it was a total lie.
But, of course, it's not just confined to John Kerry or this one, isolated non-story. Enter White House Press Secretary Tony Snow, who just yesterday, went to the Brady Briefing Room and told the nation's Press Corps a lie that all national Republicans continue to offer, despite substantial evidence to the contrary.
"You have heard me talk in recent days about how important it is to get people to focus on substantive issues," said Snow to the White House press. "And again, it's striking that in the war on terror -- winning the war on terror, Democrats have decided they're not going to tell you what their plan is. It's the most important issue; why not tell you what the plan is?"
White House reporters, perhaps tiring of being played for chumps and fed the Democrats-don't-have-a-plan line over and over again, immediately called Snow on it.
"You say that you want to see Democrats offer -- engage in a more substantive way on Iraq," pressed one reporter. "And yet when Democrats do that, their ideas are either rejected out of hand, as was the case with Biden's idea of partitioning Iraq, or in the case of Murtha, he had Republican members of Congress effectively accuse him of being a coward and say that the idea doesn't reflect reality. So when you have substantive proposals, redeploying troops is a substantive proposal, partitioning the country is substantive."
In addition to Democrat Jack Murtha learning that bringing an Iraq plan to the Republicans gets you called a coward -- even if you are a decorated combat Veteran who spent 37 years in the U.S. Marines -- the biggest element of Snow's lie is how he willfully ignores that Democrats put forth a major, comprehensive security initiative in the Senate less than two months ago and had it shot down by the GOP leadership.
On September 13, 2006, the Real Security Act of 2006, sponsored by Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV), was killed by an almost straight party-line vote in the Senate. The legislation, all 528 pages of it, offered, as its amendment purpose stated, "to provide real national security, restore United States leadership, and implement tough and smart policies to win the war on terror."
That's 528 pages of detailed description of the Democratic plan to secure our domestic infrastructure, end the war in Iraq and bring our military men and women home to their families.
But, just yesterday, in saying that Democrats have never told anyone what their plan is, Tony Snow lied yet again. This is not subject to partisan interpretation -- it is a lie. See for yourself: You can go here to see the legislation, S.AMDT. 4936.
And perhaps the most despicable of the lies surrounding the GOP's manufactured news story about John Kerry, is the fact that Republican John McCain, a fellow decorated Veteran and someone Kerry once called a friend, kept the lie going for his party in spite of what he knew was the truth. Even after the context of Kerry's remarks became clear to anyone interested in reality, McCain went on the attack, demanding that Kerry apologize for sentiments that McCain knew full well were a twisted invention of his own party.
Mighty disgusting stuff to be sure.
Politics can often be much more gray than black and white. Certainly, I've learned in covering the United States Senate that things are sometimes not what they seem and that the process of governing can at times be complex and filled with nuance.
But there are some things that are absolute. And one of those is that the Republican party of George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Karl Rove, Ken Mehlman, Tony Snow and John McCain is filled throughout with a craven pack of liars whose only interest is to remain in power, while railroading those who oppose them and scaring the hell out of each and every American along the way to achieve their goals.
And that's something even a child can understand.
Bob Geiger is a writer, activist and Democratic District Leader in Westchester County, NY.
My young son and I were talking last week about the definition of a lie. As a nine-year-old, he's expanding his boundaries and testing the waters on how little he can get away with telling my wife and me without crossing the line into being a liar. This seems to me like a perfectly normal part of childhood development so, as we talked, I used an example from last winter, when we had a misunderstanding about whether or not his school had been closed in advance of a monster snowstorm.
He told me the night before that he heard from one of the teachers that, because of the magnitude of the expected storm, classes had been called off in advance for the next day. We found out later that night that this information was incorrect, that a preemptive snow-day had not been called and my little boy promptly apologized for "lying."
I asked at the time if he knew that a snow-day had really not been called and, when he replied that he really did believe his information was correct, I explained that he had simply been mistaken and that he had not lied. If he had found out at 6:00 PM that his information was wrong, I said to him, telling me at 7:00 PM that school had already been canceled would indeed have been a lie.
My little boy understands and acknowledges that obvious distinction -- Republicans do not.
As if we need more evidence of this, Republican National Committee Chairman Ken Mehlman sent out an e-mail blast yesterday lashing John Kerry for allegedly insulting America's military personnel.
"Listen closely this election season and you'll hear the truth about what Democrats represent," wrote Mehlman. "Monday, failed Presidential candidate John Kerry brazenly insulted the brave American men and women serving in our military. In Kerry's cocoon of privilege, those who serve in our military are failures who never did their homework or 'made an effort to be smart.'"
"Our troops deserve to be honored, not insulted by the likes of John Kerry."
Mehlman ended his deceptive pitch by getting down to brass tacks and saying "We need you now to keep the John Kerry Democrats out of power."
By any sensible person's definition -- and what an average grade-school child would understand -- is that this was a lie. Ken Mehlman knew when he released this e-mail that John Kerry had not "brazenly insulted the brave American men and women serving in our military." He knew from a comparison of the prepared text and how Kerry bungled the joke he intended to tell that it was meant for Mehlman's master, George W. Bush, and not the troops in Iraq and that there was certainly nothing brazen about it.
He knew all of that as a matter of fact, in addition to knowing that, unlike the vast majority of the Republican leadership, John Kerry is a highly-decorated Veteran, who has always fought for America's Vets and active-duty military and would never lob such disrespect their way.
But Mehlman said it anyway. He knew at 1:00 PM that what he was writing was a lie. But he sent the e-mail at 2:00 PM anyway.
George W. Bush did the same thing in a speech after Kerry made his remarks but well after the truth of the Massachusetts Senator's intent was known -- he bashed Kerry, knowing it would be all over the world on nightly newscasts and also knowing that it was a total lie.
But, of course, it's not just confined to John Kerry or this one, isolated non-story. Enter White House Press Secretary Tony Snow, who just yesterday, went to the Brady Briefing Room and told the nation's Press Corps a lie that all national Republicans continue to offer, despite substantial evidence to the contrary.
"You have heard me talk in recent days about how important it is to get people to focus on substantive issues," said Snow to the White House press. "And again, it's striking that in the war on terror -- winning the war on terror, Democrats have decided they're not going to tell you what their plan is. It's the most important issue; why not tell you what the plan is?"
White House reporters, perhaps tiring of being played for chumps and fed the Democrats-don't-have-a-plan line over and over again, immediately called Snow on it.
"You say that you want to see Democrats offer -- engage in a more substantive way on Iraq," pressed one reporter. "And yet when Democrats do that, their ideas are either rejected out of hand, as was the case with Biden's idea of partitioning Iraq, or in the case of Murtha, he had Republican members of Congress effectively accuse him of being a coward and say that the idea doesn't reflect reality. So when you have substantive proposals, redeploying troops is a substantive proposal, partitioning the country is substantive."
In addition to Democrat Jack Murtha learning that bringing an Iraq plan to the Republicans gets you called a coward -- even if you are a decorated combat Veteran who spent 37 years in the U.S. Marines -- the biggest element of Snow's lie is how he willfully ignores that Democrats put forth a major, comprehensive security initiative in the Senate less than two months ago and had it shot down by the GOP leadership.
On September 13, 2006, the Real Security Act of 2006, sponsored by Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV), was killed by an almost straight party-line vote in the Senate. The legislation, all 528 pages of it, offered, as its amendment purpose stated, "to provide real national security, restore United States leadership, and implement tough and smart policies to win the war on terror."
That's 528 pages of detailed description of the Democratic plan to secure our domestic infrastructure, end the war in Iraq and bring our military men and women home to their families.
But, just yesterday, in saying that Democrats have never told anyone what their plan is, Tony Snow lied yet again. This is not subject to partisan interpretation -- it is a lie. See for yourself: You can go here to see the legislation, S.AMDT. 4936.
And perhaps the most despicable of the lies surrounding the GOP's manufactured news story about John Kerry, is the fact that Republican John McCain, a fellow decorated Veteran and someone Kerry once called a friend, kept the lie going for his party in spite of what he knew was the truth. Even after the context of Kerry's remarks became clear to anyone interested in reality, McCain went on the attack, demanding that Kerry apologize for sentiments that McCain knew full well were a twisted invention of his own party.
Mighty disgusting stuff to be sure.
Politics can often be much more gray than black and white. Certainly, I've learned in covering the United States Senate that things are sometimes not what they seem and that the process of governing can at times be complex and filled with nuance.
But there are some things that are absolute. And one of those is that the Republican party of George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Karl Rove, Ken Mehlman, Tony Snow and John McCain is filled throughout with a craven pack of liars whose only interest is to remain in power, while railroading those who oppose them and scaring the hell out of each and every American along the way to achieve their goals.
And that's something even a child can understand.
Bob Geiger is a writer, activist and Democratic District Leader in Westchester County, NY.
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:45 pm Posts: 757 Location: living, laughing, and loving...
i agree with the article, if kerry really made a mistake. i am not just going to assume he is telling the truth about this though.
the article is correct though about the washington/GOP spin/lie machine. i think they will be slaughtered in the election in both the house and senate, if the elections are not fixed. and i think the dems will take back the majority in both. i truly hope that takes place since we have seen the damage a 1 party system can create since 2002. the GOP has controlled every branch of government with a majority and of course they fucked it up. if the dems had all levels of government for 4 years they would fuck it up to. since we all know absolute power corrupts absolutely.
just wait till the dems get power and then can investigate all this shit that has been going on. we think it is bad now, this is only the tip of the iceberg. and since the GOP had control of everyhting nothing got investigated. it is like one big club that is fukcing over the people of this country and getting away with it. and the real bomb is going to be an attempted impeachment. which i fully support at this point for a host of reasons including the war, torture, domestic spying, cia leaks, abramoff, illegal detentions, habeous corpus. the list goes on and on.
but i also know that i cant trust the dems much either, because i feel they have sold out to corporate and special interests. which are not exactly our interests, but i am definitely ready to give them a shot. Of course, they have one hell of a mess to clean up, so i am willing to give them some time. anyhow, lets just say i wont be punching any "R" tickets on tuesday (who am i kidding, i never have!)
and i think i have hitched my wagon to Obama in 2008. i really have a good feeling about this guy.
_________________ to split yourself in two
is just the most radical thing you can do
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:45 pm Posts: 757 Location: living, laughing, and loving...
He then said: "You know, education -- if you make the most of it, you study hard and you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well.
"If you don't, you get stuck in Iraq."
Comment 'mangled in delivery'
A Kerry aide told CNN that the prepared statement, which had been designed to criticize President Bush, "was mangled in delivery."
Kerry was supposed to say, "I can't overstress the importance of a great education. Do you know where you end up if you don't study, if you aren't smart, if you're intellectually lazy? You end up getting us stuck in a war in Iraq."
the "original" and what he actually said have a few more differences than just "us"... he really changed alot of that part on the fly?
look, i am not saying i know for sure what he meant to say or didnt mean to say. i am just a little skeptical thats all. i still dont think he should joke about the war right now. And i believe the claims he makes IN BOTH versions are accurate. even though i dont think Bush is dumb by any stretch of the imagination.
_________________ to split yourself in two
is just the most radical thing you can do
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:45 pm Posts: 757 Location: living, laughing, and loving...
edzeppe wrote:
my2hands wrote:
i if the elections are not fixed.
go ahead and keep assuming your elections are tamper proof, and that your democracy is almighty and cannot be rigged.
just ask blacks in florida,
and then ask the blacks in ohio why they had to stand in line for 5 hours to vote in 2004.
and we wont even start talking about corporate control of your voting machines. i guess that doesnt concern you either.
people have fought and died for this democracy and the right to vote, so i think we should make sure we keep fighting for the same cause, as oppsoed to rolling our eyes when it is mentioned.
_________________ to split yourself in two
is just the most radical thing you can do
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:08 am Posts: 22978 Gender: Male
my2hands wrote:
edzeppe wrote:
my2hands wrote:
i if the elections are not fixed.
go ahead and keep assuming your elections are tamper proof, and that your democracy is almighty and cannot be rigged.
just ask blacks in florida,
and then ask the blacks in ohio why they had to stand in line for 5 hours to vote in 2004.
and we wont even start talking about corporate control of your voting machines. i guess that doesnt concern you either.
people have fought and died for this democracy and the right to vote, so i think we should make sure we keep fighting for the same cause, as oppsoed to rolling our eyes when it is mentioned.
Oh please.
No one said they cant be rigged.
What i have a problem is making a bold prediction, and then not having the courage to actually stick by it, and give yourself an immediate out.
Its like a crazy conspiracy theory- proclaim it and proclaim, and once its proven wrong just say "They're hiding the truth" or "Changing their plan because we're on to them"
I didnt think you could get anymore ridiculous than the NFL thread, but you always find a way. Kudos to you.
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:45 pm Posts: 757 Location: living, laughing, and loving...
edzeppe wrote:
my2hands wrote:
edzeppe wrote:
my2hands wrote:
i if the elections are not fixed.
go ahead and keep assuming your elections are tamper proof, and that your democracy is almighty and cannot be rigged.
just ask blacks in florida,
and then ask the blacks in ohio why they had to stand in line for 5 hours to vote in 2004.
and we wont even start talking about corporate control of your voting machines. i guess that doesnt concern you either.
people have fought and died for this democracy and the right to vote, so i think we should make sure we keep fighting for the same cause, as oppsoed to rolling our eyes when it is mentioned.
Oh please.
No one said they cant be rigged. What i have a problem is making a bold prediction, and then not having the courage to actually stick by it, and give yourself an immediate out.
Its like a crazy conspiracy theory- proclaim it and proclaim, and once its proven wrong just say "They're hiding the truth" or "Changing their plan because we're on to them"
I didnt think you could get anymore ridiculous than the NFL thread, but you always find a way. Kudos to you.
1. this is not a bold prediction. all indicators point to a Dem romp. and i am not giving myself an out, i am not on a ticket?
2. many people have concerns about the 2000,2002, and 2004 elections. so i dont think it is crazy to keep our eyes peeled.
3. if the dems dont sweep to large victories ALOT of people will be suspecting foul play
4. period.
_________________ to split yourself in two
is just the most radical thing you can do
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:45 pm Posts: 757 Location: living, laughing, and loving...
edzeppe wrote:
my2hands wrote:
edzeppe wrote:
my2hands wrote:
i if the elections are not fixed.
go ahead and keep assuming your elections are tamper proof, and that your democracy is almighty and cannot be rigged.
just ask blacks in florida,
and then ask the blacks in ohio why they had to stand in line for 5 hours to vote in 2004.
and we wont even start talking about corporate control of your voting machines. i guess that doesnt concern you either.
people have fought and died for this democracy and the right to vote, so i think we should make sure we keep fighting for the same cause, as oppsoed to rolling our eyes when it is mentioned.
Oh please.
No one said they cant be rigged. What i have a problem is making a bold prediction, and then not having the courage to actually stick by it, and give yourself an immediate out.
Its like a crazy conspiracy theory- proclaim it and proclaim, and once its proven wrong just say "They're hiding the truth" or "Changing their plan because we're on to them"
I didnt think you could get anymore ridiculous than the NFL thread, but you always find a way. Kudos to you.
your little eye roll really said all of that?
maybe you should say what your thinking instaed of putting a smilie, then jumping down my throat when i resond to a
_________________ to split yourself in two
is just the most radical thing you can do
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Chris_H_2 wrote:
my2hands wrote:
3. if the dems dont sweep to large victories ALOT of people will be suspecting foul play.
If so, that is just ridiculous . . .
Perhaps you disagree, but from where I sit the Republicans as a whole deserve to lose. They have both shown themselves to be equally as capable as the democrats of being corrupt and they have abandoned the principles of 1994 that made them, in my mind, conservative. What needs to be shown is that the Democrats are worthy of the votes that the Republicans should be losing. Of course, should doesn't always hold true to the realities of voting day.
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simple schoolboy wrote:
Chris_H_2 wrote:
my2hands wrote:
3. if the dems dont sweep to large victories ALOT of people will be suspecting foul play.
If so, that is just ridiculous . . .
Perhaps you disagree, but from where I sit the Republicans as a whole deserve to lose. They have both shown themselves to be equally as capable as the democrats of being corrupt and they have abandoned the principles of 1994 that made them, in my mind, conservative. What needs to be shown is that the Democrats are worthy of the votes that the Republicans should be losing. Of course, should doesn't always hold true to the realities of voting day.
I don't think that was the point. They were talking about vote fraud.
_________________ Unfortunately, at the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius, the Flower Children jerked off and went back to sleep.
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Buggy wrote:
Quote:
What Republicans call 'spin' the rest of the world calls 'lies'
I don't see how this isnt also true for the dems and other politicians.
maybe, but you have to admit that the republicans are pulling way ahead in that area, especially as of late. it's like they can't WAIT to make up their next line of crap just to see how many stupid americans will buy it.
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 7:44 pm Posts: 8910 Location: Santa Cruz Gender: Male
honey wrote:
Buggy wrote:
Quote:
What Republicans call 'spin' the rest of the world calls 'lies'
I don't see how this isnt also true for the dems and other politicians.
maybe, but you have to admit that the republicans are pulling way ahead in that area, especially as of late. it's like they can't WAIT to make up their next line of crap just to see how many stupid americans will buy it.
This is often true of any party that controls the majority of governmental process. They are also open to the most criticism because of it, so sometimes it's just perceptual. I dont think the democrats or republicans show any different when subject to these circumstances.
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omg. this article even points out that the written, prepared speech has the correct, intended wording in it. wtf do you require, a polygraph??
