Red Mosquito • View topic - we have not forgotten the avocado outtakes

joostone · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:03 pm

Every once in a while I try to post something on Synergy BBS, this time I really wanted that people read my thread.
Because I thought it would be interesting (way more interesting than a petition for a mtv unplugged dvd

).
Offcourse I should`ve known better, not much respons during the last 48 hours.

So I turn to you, hopefully I can make myself clear.

We all love our band, we all love their live shows.
I think that their live shows got another dimension with the release of Lost Dogs, from now they could throw a lost dog in their set and make us jamheads very happy. Examples: Sad on the 2006 Reading festival or Education on Lolla 07 were both teasers and pleasers for the diehards (a fan who owns every record is enough diehard for now:)).

All I want to say is this:

I have not forgotten the avocado outtakes!!

The reason why I love this band some much is also the way the always think forward. Every record has it own fresh feel. But sometimes I have this feeling that they forget that what`s in the vault.
It`s easy to understand why, let`s say Stone brings in 10 near finished song ideas. The band decides to work on five of those and record them. Only 2 will show up on the record. Three will remain in the vaults, Stone continues to write songs for himself without looking back. Ask him about All Those Yesterdays and he will say it`s his favorite song on No Code

(from my own experience). This is a strange way to point out that it is easy to forget to do something with earlier recorded tracks.

So please read this thread, I think it`s an interesting read on outtakes and what to do with it.
http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=257234

So sign that thread, or this one (both) to show somehow that you also have not forgotten the avocado outtakes and that the band had vague plans to release it somehow. (OOR music magazine may06)

Let the band look forward so we can expect some great tunes in 2008/09 (who knows) so we can take a look back

.

Maybe some of us will start `an organized religion` (sticky, petition, mails, signs, banners, etc...)

joostone · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:04 pm

This was my original BBS post:

Quote:

I would like to start this thread with the following eddie qoute:

"You fucking cocksuckers. You fucking bitch! You know, we come up here as a collective band and we give and we give and you just fucking want more ... and you know what? You deserve it. This is like some kind of organized religion here; I've never seen anything like it. Do you see what's happening? ... the third night in a row, right? Well, fuck you. We're gonna play it!" (Eddie, MSG NY, 11-9-98)

1)Of all the thing this band has given us I would like to talk about Lost Dogs.
This is a great record, with (IMHO) some of their best tracks they recorded, songs as Sad, Down, Fatal, Education, Alone are all great tracks and this release clearly showed us that the vault have some great songs that can work very well in a live setting.

2)But one thing is for sure, the recording sessions for S/T are probably the most fruitfull they have ever done. They could easily fill a full lenght record with the remaining tracks. I base this on numerous interviews the band has done in 2005, they we`re talking about tracks that never appeared on S/T. I think that S/T is a great record and I`m really looking forward to their next record (2008/09 who knows). As I stated above it's clearly that there are wheels and reels of tracks that were not included on avocado. Partly because it was their hardest and most time consuming recording session as a collective band. Well, what to do with these tracks? There was that 06 interview in that Dutch magazine called OOR in which eddie told us there were lots of songs recorded and it was very hard to pick the ones that would make the record. And recently he was talking with Stone about the possibility to somehow release the tracks that didn't make the record. (OOR, MAY2006).Obviously that very interesting idea never became concrete. Hopefully the leftover S/T tracks will not be forgotten.

3) Although Lost Dogs was a great collection of ODDS & SODDS it`s not complete, there are still some tracks out there that should be compiled (well, atleast it would make some fans very happy). I`m talking about some b-sides, fanclubsingles and tracks that are on rough mixes for the TEN and LOST DOGS records (but didn`t make the cut). Those rough mixes/promos are widely available on bootlegs. Also the inside picture showing the PJ vault in the LD record also made us curious .

4) After some homework here I present you LAST DOGS , one more attempt of showing the fans how great this band can be, more songs that can be played live and be loved by thousands of fans worldwide. (After some succes of Who`s missing, the great The WHO released Two`s missing, or even the CD reissue of ODDS & SODDS showed what this band was also capable of, sure we all love The Who ).

DISK 1: B-sides, fanclubs, rough mixes up untill 2000 (to complete lost dogs)

-Long Road
-Puzzle and Game
-Sonic Reducer
-Leatherman
-Happy When Im Crying
-Sunburn
-Just a Girl
-Brother (vocals)
-Angel
-Crazy Mary
-Fallen (falling down)
-(untitled hidden track `Im still Here`)

To consider for Disk 1: Last Soldier (studio ??) New Jeremy (studio??), Anything in Between (vocals??), Change*, Smokering*, the Big Word*, Little Word*, The Morning Song*, Your Face*, Thrill*.
(*= This song title appears on the inside cover photograph of the Lost Dogs Pearl Jam album. The photograph depicts several shelves which is part of the vault of recording tapes Pearl Jam has accumulated over the years. Presumably, this song is either unreleased or possibly an already released song that has since been retitled. Until it is known for sure which is the case, we will assume it is an unreleased song in the vault).

Not to consider: Olympic Platinum, Dont believe in Xmas, Someday at Xmas. All fun songs but I think they are not interesting enough to be one a compilation like this.

DISK 2: S/T avocado outtakes (with some Riot Act outtakes?)

When in 2005 interviews with bandmembers showed up they we're talking alot about the upcoming record and how exctited they were making it.

"Ament singled out two other tracks as his current favorites. "One is called 'Of the Earth,' that's a song Ed wrote that is kind of a cross between early Peter Gabriel/ Genesis and Sleater-Kinney with, like, the Who's Live at Leeds or something."

Not long after those interview lists like this showed up aswell (could be false or mistitled, nothing confirmed):

1. 2X4
2. Her
3. Driving Your Point Home
4. Rusted nail
5. Armor
7. Cigarette War
8. Basic Human
9. Silver Lining
10. Marked
11. Goodbye
12. Harker's Revenge
13. Winter
14. Cold Concession
15. Keep Up
16. Last Day
18. Hand Dealt
19. Frost bitten
21. Tripping
22. Postcards
23. Simple
24. Statement

And there was an article/statement about the upcoming worldwide suicide single:'Pearl Jam will release a first single on March 13th called Worldwide
Suicide with two unreleased b-sides: 'Walkin' Man' and 'Deepest
Thing'''

Also to consider: Love Reign O Me, upcoming songs on new DVD ???

Since we cannot say something about these songs I`ve just posted what has been posted in interviews/statements in 2005. I looks like there are enough tracks to make a great disk.

Well, anyway thanks for reading. Hopefully this thread stays alive long enough, remember this is just an idea, just some hypothetical `What if` discussion, but if we can show that we all like ideas like this, who knows ?? .
Maybe someone will start `an organized religion`.

Mine · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:11 pm

Don't be surprised if your thread disappears from synergy. I doubt Avocado alone produced enough left overs for a decent lost dogs II.

pjnothingman · **Joined:** Tue Oct 19, 2004 6:07 pm **Posts:** 680

You're making a huge assumption that the avocado b-sides are fully realized songs. Just because there's a list does not mean that the songs are finished. Take for example, Other Side. They didn't finish the song until after the Riot Act tour. Another example is Anything In Between. Nice music, but the lyrics are not there. Yet another example is Puzzles and Games. I know stip goes gaga over this song, but I'd rather hear fully realized tracks than Eddie mumbling over them.

conoalias · **Joined:** Fri Sep 02, 2005 5:20 am **Posts:** 31173

pjnothingman wrote:

You're making a huge assumption that the avocado b-sides are fully realized songs. Just because there's a list does not mean that the songs are finished. Take for example, Other Side. They didn't finish the song until after the Riot Act tour. Another example is Anything In Between. Nice music, but the lyrics are not there. Yet another example is Puzzles and Games. I know stip goes gaga over this song, but I'd rather hear fully realized tracks than Eddie mumbling over them.

Other Side was released as a B-side in 2002, prior to the tour.

conoalias · **Joined:** Fri Sep 02, 2005 5:20 am **Posts:** 31173

either way, LD came out when? late 03 right? i'd say let's wait another 10-15 years till we start requesting a part deux.

Mine · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:05 pm

pjnothingman wrote:

You're making a huge assumption that the avocado b-sides are fully realized songs. Just because there's a list does not mean that the songs are finished. Take for example, Other Side. They didn't finish the song until after the Riot Act tour. Another example is Anything In Between. Nice music, but the lyrics are not there. Yet another example is Puzzles and Games. I know stip goes gaga over this song, but I'd rather hear fully realized tracks than Eddie mumbling over them.

And let me add i don't think they are really interested into finishing them right now.

badabing · **Joined:** Mon Feb 13, 2006 4:50 pm **Posts:** 2792

15 years....I'll be two years shy of 50....do I really need to wait till middle age to hear a new b-side?

warehouse · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:17 pm

there's avocado outtakes? i completely forgot

dirtyfrank0705 · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:25 pm

This is a nice gesture, and I'd love to get my hands on some "new" Pearl Jam, but I doubt it will happen any time in the near future. Someday there will be a huge box set a la Lost Dogs (IMO), but we may have to wait a little while longer. And I'm okay with that.

denverapolis · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:31 pm

i rather have an album of new stuff than some leftovers, even if "sad 2" is in there i don't care.

Isaac Turner · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:38 pm

badabing wrote:

15 years....I'll be two years shy of 50....do I really need to wait till middle age to hear a new b-side?

you're in them now friend...

Frank The Bunny · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:39 pm

yes......but they also didn't fully complete some of the songs on lost dogs until they were actually putting it together. So making another lost dogs, or lost dogs 2 or whatever it would be called....... they could put the finishing touches on the songs or lost gems now.

joostone · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:52 pm

The reason why I started this thread is mostly because of that Dutch interview (OOR magazine 2006) in that interview eddie said that he was talking to Stone about releasing the avocado outtakes.
So yes, I think that there are some complete songs recorded and at some point they were discussing it"s release. But that was 18 months ago, clearly they decide not to or forgot about it.
Well, I have not forgot about it, hence this thread

punkdavid · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 11:37 pm

conoalias wrote:

pjnothingman wrote:

You're making a huge assumption that the avocado b-sides are fully realized songs. Just because there's a list does not mean that the songs are finished. Take for example, Other Side. They didn't finish the song until after the Riot Act tour. Another example is Anything In Between. Nice music, but the lyrics are not there. Yet another example is Puzzles and Games. I know stip goes gaga over this song, but I'd rather hear fully realized tracks than Eddie mumbling over them.

Other Side was released as a B-side in 2002, prior to the tour.

It was actually released in early 2003, but yes, before the tour.

SLH916 · **Posted:** Thu Sep 13, 2007 11:41 pm

joostone wrote:

The reason why I started this thread is mostly because of that Dutch interview (OOR magazine 2006) in that interview eddie said that he was talking to Stone about releasing the avocado outtakes.
So yes, I think that there are some complete songs recorded and at some point they were discussing it"s release. But that was 18 months ago, clearly they decide not to or forgot about it.
Well, I have not forgot about it, hence this thread

Can you get us a link to the article? I had read in other interviews that they had worked on as many as 45 different pieces of music, but I never heard how many were finished. Perhaps they never released them because Stone thought they weren't very good? Would you still want them if they weren't good?

conoalias · **Joined:** Fri Sep 02, 2005 5:20 am **Posts:** 31173

punkdavid wrote:

conoalias wrote:

pjnothingman wrote:

You're making a huge assumption that the avocado b-sides are fully realized songs. Just because there's a list does not mean that the songs are finished. Take for example, Other Side. They didn't finish the song until after the Riot Act tour. Another example is Anything In Between. Nice music, but the lyrics are not there. Yet another example is Puzzles and Games. I know stip goes gaga over this song, but I'd rather hear fully realized tracks than Eddie mumbling over them.

Other Side was released as a B-side in 2002, prior to the tour.

It was actually released in early 2003, but yes, before the tour.

you sir, are correct. i was thinking Undone for a second there.

pjnothingman · **Joined:** Tue Oct 19, 2004 6:07 pm **Posts:** 680

conoalias wrote:

punkdavid wrote:

conoalias wrote:

pjnothingman wrote:

You're making a huge assumption that the avocado b-sides are fully realized songs. Just because there's a list does not mean that the songs are finished. Take for example, Other Side. They didn't finish the song until after the Riot Act tour. Another example is Anything In Between. Nice music, but the lyrics are not there. Yet another example is Puzzles and Games. I know stip goes gaga over this song, but I'd rather hear fully realized tracks than Eddie mumbling over them.

Other Side was released as a B-side in 2002, prior to the tour.

It was actually released in early 2003, but yes, before the tour.

you sir, are correct. i was thinking Undone for a second there.

Whoops, my bad. I just remember it took them some time to finish it.

They also might not want to release the avocado b-sides because they're thinking about putting some of them on the next album.

joostone · **Posted:** Fri Sep 14, 2007 10:28 am

pjnothingman wrote:

conoalias wrote:

punkdavid wrote:

conoalias wrote:

pjnothingman wrote:

You're making a huge assumption that the avocado b-sides are fully realized songs. Just because there's a list does not mean that the songs are finished. Take for example, Other Side. They didn't finish the song until after the Riot Act tour. Another example is Anything In Between. Nice music, but the lyrics are not there. Yet another example is Puzzles and Games. I know stip goes gaga over this song, but I'd rather hear fully realized tracks than Eddie mumbling over them.

Other Side was released as a B-side in 2002, prior to the tour.

It was actually released in early 2003, but yes, before the tour.

you sir, are correct. i was thinking Undone for a second there.

Whoops, my bad. I just remember it took them some time to finish it.

They also might not want to release the avocado b-sides because they're thinking about putting some of them on the next album.

Yes, that could be, but so far this hasn`t been the case with most of their songs, only a handfull songs were used on following records. Whipping, Brain of J, Parting Ways, and that`s about it. I believe that parts of Severed hand were written at the same time I am Mine was written, but it wasn`t a full song until the avocado sessions.

I`m talking about completed and recorded songs at the avocado sessions, the most important info we have here is that dutch interview. I`ll try to look it up somewhere, but although it`s dutch you have to believe me that it talked about releasing the outtakes.

OmegaprimeVKM · **Posted:** Fri Sep 14, 2007 12:01 pm

There are plenty of examples of songs that were not released for the album they were written for. Even so, I think I'd not rush the band. I can wait till 2009 to hear the next record, even if the last one wasn't their best by a long shot. My reasoning is that it'll be studio album 9, 18 years since the release of Ten. A new album every 2 years is by far not bad going at all.

we have not forgotten the avocado outtakes

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