A Boston man has filed a class-action lawsuit accusing hardware maker HP and office supply retailer Staples of colluding to inflate the price of printer ink cartridges in violation of federal antitrust law. According to the suit, HP allegedly paid Staples $100 million to refrain from selling inexpensive third-party ink cartridges, although the suit doesn't make it clear how plaintiff Ranjit Bedi arrived at that figure.
For most printer companies, ink is the bread and butter of their business. The price of ink for HP ink-jet printers can be as much as $8,000 per gallon, a figure that makes gas-pump price gouging look tame. HP is currently the dominant company in the printing market, and a considerable portion of the company's profits come from ink.
The printer makers have been waging an all-out war against third-party vendors that sell replacement cartridges at a fraction of the price. The tactics employed by the printer makers to maintain monopoly control over ink distribution for their printing products have become increasingly aggressive. In the past, we have seen HP, Epson, Lenovo and other companies attempt to use patents and even the Digital Millennium Copyright Act in their efforts to crush third-party ink distributors.
The companies have also turned to using the ink equivalent of DRM, the use of microchips embedded in ink cartridges that work with a corresponding technical mechanism in the printer that blocks the use of unauthorized third-party ink. Adding insult to injury, most printers are lying, filthy ink thieves, according to a recent study, misreporting that they are low on ink when they are not.
Bedi's suit asks for unspecified damages and an injunction barring the two companies from engaging in anticompetitive business practices.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:34 pm
too drunk to moderate properly
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:19 pm Posts: 39068 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA Gender: Male
*waits for argument that if people will spend it, HP should be allowed to charge it*
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:46 pm
Of Counsel
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:14 am Posts: 37778 Location: OmaGOD!!! Gender: Male
B wrote:
*waits for argument that if people will spend it, HP should be allowed to charge it*
Well, I won't go there, because there seems to be a good amount of evidence that they are using unfair practices to stifle competition, but I have no doubt that you would be unable to buy a color desktop printer for $75 if teh ink cartridges cost a reasonable amount of money. It's a trade-off.
_________________ Unfortunately, at the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius, the Flower Children jerked off and went back to sleep.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:00 pm
The Maleficent
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:17 pm Posts: 13551 Location: is a jerk in wyoming Gender: Female
The black ink on my printers have always either dried out or indicated the cartridge was empty way before any other color- and I don't really use it that much.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:03 pm
Stone's Bitch
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:43 pm Posts: 7633 Location: Philly Del Fia Gender: Female
What about Ink Stops and places that replace the INK without replacing the cartridge?
I'm really bugged by corporations trying to control what people do with products after they purchase them (*coughiphonecough*). It's mine now, and I should be able to use whatever ink I want.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:09 pm
Administrator
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:51 pm Posts: 14534 Location: Mesa,AZ
NaiveAndTrue wrote:
What about Ink Stops and places that replace the INK without replacing the cartridge?
I'm really bugged by corporations trying to control what people do with products after they purchase them (*coughiphonecough*). It's mine now, and I should be able to use whatever ink I want.
Yeah, that's the problem. To be honest, I don't mind ink cartridge costs, since most new printers are fairly cheap (as PD mentioned), and they generally come with one or two cartridges. The problem is when they rig the cartridges so that refills don't work. People should be able to refill the cartridges (do it outside, it's messy!) if they please.
_________________
John Adams wrote:
In my many years I have come to a conclusion that one useless man is a shame, two is a law firm, and three or more is a congress.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:41 am
Spambot
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:13 pm Posts: 2948 Location: Caucusland
Leave it alone. If they want to line up their shit and not lease out to third-party (like pretty much Apple lawl) it's their right; people buying printers know ink fuckin' runs out, and HP has a right to make their ink for their machine exclusive. It's also Staples' right not to sell third-party shit, and HP's right to pay them in a contract to not do it (provided it's legal; many companies make exclusive agreements with each other to artificially inflate price and fall flat-fail on their dumbass faces, so I don't see why this should be IL-legal).
They want to charge tons for this shit? Fuck it, let 'em. I feel bad for the people who bought HP printers and didn't know, but I'd bet some folks aren't going to choose HP now, and the printing division of HP is going to go down the toilet with or without a lawsuit. That's the benefit of a good, healthy market: when you pull epic fail like this, you will get epic fail for your business.
Ah hell fuck it on my libertarian stance with this topic. I hope they sue HP and Staples into oblivion. They both suck balls.
_________________
Bob Knight wrote:
When my time on Earth is gone, and my activities here are passed, I want they bury me upside down so my critics can kiss my ass.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:50 am
Of Counsel
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:14 am Posts: 37778 Location: OmaGOD!!! Gender: Male
Merrill wrote:
Leave it alone. If they want to line up their shit and not lease out to third-party (like pretty much Apple lawl) it's their right; people buying printers know ink fuckin' runs out, and HP has a right to make their ink for their machine exclusive. It's also Staples' right not to sell third-party shit, and HP's right to pay them in a contract to not do it (provided it's legal; many companies make exclusive agreements with each other to artificially inflate price and fall flat-fail on their dumbass faces, so I don't see why this should be IL-legal).
They want to charge tons for this shit? Fuck it, let 'em. I feel bad for the people who bought HP printers and didn't know, but I'd bet some folks aren't going to choose HP now, and the printing division of HP is going to go down the toilet with or without a lawsuit. That's the benefit of a good, healthy market: when you pull epic fail like this, you will get epic fail for your business.
Ah hell fuck it on my libertarian stance with this topic. I hope they sue HP and Staples into oblivion. They both suck balls.
It's not just HP. I've got the same problem with my Canon. Black refills are $7, color ones are like $23.
_________________ Unfortunately, at the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius, the Flower Children jerked off and went back to sleep.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:57 am
Spambot
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:13 pm Posts: 2948 Location: Caucusland
punkdavid wrote:
Merrill wrote:
Leave it alone. If they want to line up their shit and not lease out to third-party (like pretty much Apple lawl) it's their right; people buying printers know ink fuckin' runs out, and HP has a right to make their ink for their machine exclusive. It's also Staples' right not to sell third-party shit, and HP's right to pay them in a contract to not do it (provided it's legal; many companies make exclusive agreements with each other to artificially inflate price and fall flat-fail on their dumbass faces, so I don't see why this should be IL-legal).
They want to charge tons for this shit? Fuck it, let 'em. I feel bad for the people who bought HP printers and didn't know, but I'd bet some folks aren't going to choose HP now, and the printing division of HP is going to go down the toilet with or without a lawsuit. That's the benefit of a good, healthy market: when you pull epic fail like this, you will get epic fail for your business.
Ah hell fuck it on my libertarian stance with this topic. I hope they sue HP and Staples into oblivion. They both suck balls.
It's not just HP. I've got the same problem with my Canon. Black refills are $7, color ones are like $23.
If this really is a conspired overinflation, if I were a CEO of one of the companies I'd drop out immediately of the conspiracy and lower my prices even if I didn't lend patent out to third parties; fuck what the other companies would slip me under the table to prevent it, I'd be assured of overcoming the amount. The competition would be crushed and routed.
A conspiracy to artificially inflate these prices amongst several companies is a monstrously ignorant idea, I hope some genius comes around with an "open-source" printer - if you will - and massacres these shitstains on the underwear of capitalism.
_________________
Bob Knight wrote:
When my time on Earth is gone, and my activities here are passed, I want they bury me upside down so my critics can kiss my ass.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:07 am
Of Counsel
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:14 am Posts: 37778 Location: OmaGOD!!! Gender: Male
Merrill wrote:
A conspiracy to artificially inflate these prices amongst several companies is a monstrously ignorant idea, I hope some genius comes around with an "open-source" printer - if you will - and massacres these shitstains on the underwear of capitalism.
But then Microsoft will make it so that there's no compatible driver to run the thing.
Check and mate.
_________________ Unfortunately, at the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius, the Flower Children jerked off and went back to sleep.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 8:20 am
Spambot
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:13 pm Posts: 2948 Location: Caucusland
punkdavid wrote:
Merrill wrote:
A conspiracy to artificially inflate these prices amongst several companies is a monstrously ignorant idea, I hope some genius comes around with an "open-source" printer - if you will - and massacres these shitstains on the underwear of capitalism.
But then Apple will make it so that there's no compatible driver to run the thing.
Check and mate.
lolfixed, now you win the argument
_________________
Bob Knight wrote:
When my time on Earth is gone, and my activities here are passed, I want they bury me upside down so my critics can kiss my ass.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:29 pm
Yeah Yeah Yeah
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:57 pm Posts: 3332 Location: Chicago-ish
punkdavid wrote:
Merrill wrote:
A conspiracy to artificially inflate these prices amongst several companies is a monstrously ignorant idea, I hope some genius comes around with an "open-source" printer - if you will - and massacres these shitstains on the underwear of capitalism.
But then Microsoft will make it so that there's no compatible driver to run the thing.
Check and mate.
Nah, someone will hack it and release it Never underestimate the hatred for MS
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:09 pm
Administrator
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:51 pm Posts: 14534 Location: Mesa,AZ
punkdavid wrote:
Merrill wrote:
A conspiracy to artificially inflate these prices amongst several companies is a monstrously ignorant idea, I hope some genius comes around with an "open-source" printer - if you will - and massacres these shitstains on the underwear of capitalism.
But then Microsoft will make it so that there's no compatible driver to run the thing.
Check and mate.
If the printer manufacturer reverse-engineered the communication protocol that the most popular printer uses and mimics that, there's nothing Microsoft could do to block people from using the thing... The real problem is it would take several years to create a decent printer from scratch, and quite an investment. You'd have to have a whole boatload of money to get such a project off the ground, and you'd have to know before you made such an investment that the printer market situation would be exactly the same as it is now. The only possibility I see is that a large company decides to do that and undercuts the other companies' ink prices, but then for that to work, most consumers would need to know that the ink prices were being undercut by somebody.
_________________
John Adams wrote:
In my many years I have come to a conclusion that one useless man is a shame, two is a law firm, and three or more is a congress.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:23 pm
too drunk to moderate properly
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:19 pm Posts: 39068 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA Gender: Male
punkdavid wrote:
B wrote:
*waits for argument that if people will spend it, HP should be allowed to charge it*
Well, I won't go there, because there seems to be a good amount of evidence that they are using unfair practices to stifle competition, but I have no doubt that you would be unable to buy a color desktop printer for $75 if the ink cartridges cost a reasonable amount of money. It's a trade-off.
I guess it's the same reason that Gillette gives away razors that use "disposable" $5 cartridges.
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
Post subject: Re: $8,000-per-gallon printer ink leads to antitrust lawsuit
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:41 pm
Got Some
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 2:07 pm Posts: 1787
LittleWing wrote:
One of my professors worked for Xerox. There's a lot of unseen stuff, stuff that you just wouldn't think of, that's going on in these inks.
With 75% profit margins for ink sales, that seems to be a nonissue. Even Mark Hurd acknowledges that they use the Gillette business model.
_________________ This year's hallway bounty: tampon dipped in ketchup, mouthguard, one sock, severed teddy bear head, pregnancy test, gym bag containing unwashed gym clothes and a half-eaten sandwich
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