Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:52 pm Posts: 1727 Location: Earth Gender: Male
I don't believe they exist. Do you? If so why?
_________________ "The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum." -Noam Chomsky
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:52 pm Posts: 1727 Location: Earth Gender: Male
IHailRandyMoss wrote:
I hope you all know that were dealing with something far beyond our understanding of reality. Make no mistake, they don't come from space. That is the deception we fall under, that they come from space. They come from other dimensions that interact with our world. We can't see those dimensions, but they can see us. That dimension is hell. Satan has us by the balls when we say they come from outer space. They're evil.
_________________ "The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum." -Noam Chomsky
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:52 pm Posts: 1727 Location: Earth Gender: Male
PunkDavid wrote:
There is no hell, there is no Satan, there is no evil. Il y a les petits hommes verts.
_________________ "The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum." -Noam Chomsky
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:19 pm Posts: 39068 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA Gender: Male
The Bible tells me so ...
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:04 pm Posts: 39920 Gender: Male
Yes I believe they exist, but it should always been the furtherest thing from a persons mind if they aren't completely demonic, because you won't have to worry about going there after this life. Also if you read the Vedic scriptures, the Hellish planets are not ever lasting misery. In the Vedas the "devil" of sorts is called Yamaraja, and even he says "so and so person is here to suffer horribly for 100 years, then he will be reborn as a goat" or any example like that.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:14 am Posts: 37778 Location: OmaGOD!!! Gender: Male
I'll have a go at it.
I'm not convinced that there is any afterlife at all. However, if there is, I believe there is only one type of afterlife, not the dualism of the Christian Heaven and Hell.
I believe that upon death your "soul" (I, eye, essence, spirit) is released from your body-mind matrix and joins with the great soul of the universe like a drop of water returning to the sea. The process of extraction from your corporeal self takes place in an instant as measured by time as we know it, but the subjective experience for the dying person may seem like eons. The process of the soul leaving the body of which it has been so deeply integrated for so long, is the very definition of "catharsis". The question is how much pain is going to be involved in the process to your eventual ecstatic release from the realm of matter and form.
I believe that the process involves the revelation of ultimate truth. Those who more easily accept that truth will have an easier journey to the eternal. Those who fight the truth and struggle against the process will endure more pain and suffering on their way to the eternal. In fact, the truth itself will undoubtedly be very painful, much more so for some than for others. This pain and suffering, and the amount of suffering that one must endure on the way to joining the eternal is what some may understand as hell. But there is no eternal damnation. We all pass through to the good and the eternal, it is merely a question of how we cope with the ultimate truth of the universe when our time comes.
How's that sound?
--PunkDavid
_________________ Unfortunately, at the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius, the Flower Children jerked off and went back to sleep.
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:15 pm Posts: 25452 Location: Under my wing like Sanford & Son Gender: Male
This isn't really an answer to the question, but just a comment on Satan. What I think some people don't realize is that Lucifer was God's favorite, the "Morning Star" of Heaven, and that he feel from grace. He was not always evil. If you forget this, you take away most of the dynamic qualities of Satan and form a false impression of evil. I personally think the fall of Lucifer is one of the most interesting stories in existence.
_________________ Now that god no longer exists, the desire for another world still remains.
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:17 pm Posts: 13551 Location: is a jerk in wyoming Gender: Female
IEB! wrote:
I don't believe they exist. Do you? If so why?
No, not really. I think the ideas of heaven and hell were just a reordering of older stories that had been in existence for as long as people have been thinking.
They’re good social controls and help keep civilization...civilized. The ideas of heaven and hell as the bible tells about them make sense for keeping a society running smoothly. Most of the things you purportedly go to hell for are crimes that you ultimately do damage to your society by committing, so some kind of ultimate punishment is a logical way of enforcing rules that are beneficial to the advancement of the society. Same thing with the idea of heaven, do things right, be a productive member of your society, presto, paradise when you die.
Even the Islamic radicals that crashed into the World Trade Towers were motivated by the idea of an ultimate reward of paradise in their supposed martyrdom.
I always liked the idea of being able to once again see the people who I've lost (and my pets too for that matter) so I'd like to believe there's some further forward motion when the body goes away, something that allows you to still know that presense that was your parent or your cat after physical death.
And the idea that a person's soul gets punished when they die... I dunno, but I had a friend who had a good idea about that kind of thing. She said she liked to think that people who are evil have to keep coming back (I guess you can call that reincarnation) and trying to do right this time around before they're able to move any further.
She kind of looked at living and whatever happens after you die (if anything) as going to school, you fail your classes? you repeat until you get a passing grade, and are allowed to go on to college.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 12:35 am Posts: 1311 Location: Lexington
punkdavid wrote:
I'll have a go at it.
I'm not convinced that there is any afterlife at all. However, if there is, I believe there is only one type of afterlife, not the dualism of the Christian Heaven and Hell.
I believe that upon death your "soul" (I, eye, essence, spirit) is released from your body-mind matrix and joins with the great soul of the universe like a drop of water returning to the sea. The process of extraction from your corporeal self takes place in an instant as measured by time as we know it, but the subjective experience for the dying person may seem like eons. The process of the soul leaving the body of which it has been so deeply integrated for so long, is the very definition of "catharsis". The question is how much pain is going to be involved in the process to your eventual ecstatic release from the realm of matter and form.
I believe that the process involves the revelation of ultimate truth. Those who more easily accept that truth will have an easier journey to the eternal. Those who fight the truth and struggle against the process will endure more pain and suffering on their way to the eternal. In fact, the truth itself will undoubtedly be very painful, much more so for some than for others. This pain and suffering, and the amount of suffering that one must endure on the way to joining the eternal is what some may understand as hell. But there is no eternal damnation. We all pass through to the good and the eternal, it is merely a question of how we cope with the ultimate truth of the universe when our time comes.
How's that sound?
--PunkDavid
That lets you sleep at night?
_________________
punkdavid wrote:
Make sure to bring a bottle of vitriol. And wear a condom so you don't insinuate her.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:14 am Posts: 37778 Location: OmaGOD!!! Gender: Male
deathbyflannel wrote:
punkdavid wrote:
I'll have a go at it.
I'm not convinced that there is any afterlife at all. However, if there is, I believe there is only one type of afterlife, not the dualism of the Christian Heaven and Hell.
I believe that upon death your "soul" (I, eye, essence, spirit) is released from your body-mind matrix and joins with the great soul of the universe like a drop of water returning to the sea. The process of extraction from your corporeal self takes place in an instant as measured by time as we know it, but the subjective experience for the dying person may seem like eons. The process of the soul leaving the body of which it has been so deeply integrated for so long, is the very definition of "catharsis". The question is how much pain is going to be involved in the process to your eventual ecstatic release from the realm of matter and form.
I believe that the process involves the revelation of ultimate truth. Those who more easily accept that truth will have an easier journey to the eternal. Those who fight the truth and struggle against the process will endure more pain and suffering on their way to the eternal. In fact, the truth itself will undoubtedly be very painful, much more so for some than for others. This pain and suffering, and the amount of suffering that one must endure on the way to joining the eternal is what some may understand as hell. But there is no eternal damnation. We all pass through to the good and the eternal, it is merely a question of how we cope with the ultimate truth of the universe when our time comes.
How's that sound?
--PunkDavid
That lets you sleep at night?
Sure. I'm not so egotistical to feel the need for my personality to survive my body. Besides, I can think of nothing more satisfying than to learn the ultimate truth of the universe and become one with it.
--PunkDavid
_________________ Unfortunately, at the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius, the Flower Children jerked off and went back to sleep.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:52 pm Posts: 6822 Location: NY Gender: Male
I believe there's an afterlife. I'm still trying to piece together what that may be. However, I have no problems letting other people believe, or not believe, in what may occur after our lives on earth. Cliche, yes...but oh well.
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:52 pm Posts: 1727 Location: Earth Gender: Male
Peeps wrote:
IEB! wrote:
I don't believe they exist. Do you? If so why?
do you believe in GOD and Heaven?
i find it weird that people wont believe in satan or hell, yet can believe in GOD and Heaven
No, I don't believe in God or Heaven.
_________________ "The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum." -Noam Chomsky
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 8:17 pm Posts: 468 Location: Indiana
punkdavid wrote:
I'll have a go at it.
I'm not convinced that there is any afterlife at all. However, if there is, I believe there is only one type of afterlife, not the dualism of the Christian Heaven and Hell.
I believe that upon death your "soul" (I, eye, essence, spirit) is released from your body-mind matrix and joins with the great soul of the universe like a drop of water returning to the sea. The process of extraction from your corporeal self takes place in an instant as measured by time as we know it, but the subjective experience for the dying person may seem like eons. The process of the soul leaving the body of which it has been so deeply integrated for so long, is the very definition of "catharsis". The question is how much pain is going to be involved in the process to your eventual ecstatic release from the realm of matter and form.
I believe that the process involves the revelation of ultimate truth. Those who more easily accept that truth will have an easier journey to the eternal. Those who fight the truth and struggle against the process will endure more pain and suffering on their way to the eternal. In fact, the truth itself will undoubtedly be very painful, much more so for some than for others. This pain and suffering, and the amount of suffering that one must endure on the way to joining the eternal is what some may understand as hell. But there is no eternal damnation. We all pass through to the good and the eternal, it is merely a question of how we cope with the ultimate truth of the universe when our time comes.
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