I think record sales are still down quite a bit though (and I think that includes itunes although I'm not sure about that). I'd also guess that the kinds of music fans who would be going to smaller stores/spending a lot on music are more likely to be the kinds of people who would jump on the free downloading wagon and so those stores would be hit much harder than someone buying top 40 stuff from wal-mart (or PJ from target)

edit:
I guess this thread was split or something, makes no sense out of context.

If the Target thing is true (and I'm not jumping the gun on that yet) this is a good point. We are in the middle of a huge shift in how the music industry works, so if I can use this to rationalize it, then it'll make me feel a little better.

If it's true, it'll feel pretty wrong, but like you said, Pearl Jam are allowed to make money.

If it's true, why Target rather than the independent stores they have supported? Stores like Best Buy, Wal-Mart and Target are the real reason why indie stores are suffering, not downloading. This would be a huge slap in the face to them.

Target is the more indie store compared to Best Buy and Wal-Mart.

Seriously? They Are?!
OMG!!!!

















You guys always make this point in defense of them.... be it for
A.) Casino Shows.
B.) Playing AOL/Time Warner Sessions- while bashing multi media corps.
C.) Ever increasing ticket prices
D.) Allowing songs to be used on primetime tv for royalties.
E.) Playing Clear Channel Venues
F.) High Dollar, exclusionary by design special shows with special sets.
G.) Fragmented tour announcements
H.) Membership requirements to use their message board
I.) Riding in SUVs weeks after "Dont Drive Me Im an SUV..."
J.) VH1 specials, which is ANOTHER multi media, huge corporation.
k.) Hardcore Nader/3rd Party... Oh wait, Now its Kerry!!!



And you know what? None of that shit bothers me, cause you're right- they have a right to make money... but they (well, ed) should stop his bitching about "have's" and "have nots".... Cause he is obviously now living his life as a "have" at the expense of the "have nots". Live how you want boys- just stop complaining about it.

Couldn't have said it better than Stip. I'll reserve my judgement, and there are plenty of ways to contribute to charities in this way as well (fingers crossed). Remember, this is the band that gave away the ENTIRE proceeds of Last Kiss (a shit load of money), at the very least they deserve our patience.

you don't have to be an ascetic monk to be concerned about the way wealth/resources are distributed within this country or throughout the planet. That's a structural critique that has very little to do with the particular well being (or lack thereof) of any particular person.

Yeah. Seriously.

I really don't see the big deal. The record industry is dying a slow death. Artists have to get creative in there attempts to sell records. Even if this is true, it is a hell of great idea. How many times a week do you find yourself going " I gotta pick ____ up from target this week?" People who are still concerned with the whole selling out thing need to seriously get out of there basements, throw out the flannels, get a haircut, shower and get on with life.

And you dont think its slightly hypocritical of him to basically recite the whole thing along the lines of..


Man this country is so inequitable because 10% of the population have 90% of the wealth... when he is one of the 10%, at the expense of everyone else?




*stats made up, but i think you get the concept

next time I have 3-4 days off I'll make a post about all the bullshit politics Ed has preached to us over the years that theyve either abandoned or never followed in the first place. the trash that he (or Tom Morello or Gloria Steinem) preaches from the stage just balances out alot of the radical right wing trash spewed by people like Rush Limbaugh. common sense is somewhere in the middle, IMO. things arent always as black and white as Ed makes them sound, and when the $ is in front of you (or the convict killed someone you love), the decisions arent always as easy. he's human...dont believe everything he says.

just my opinion.

if you've heard 3/29/94, you've heard Ed speak in favor of death penalty, and we all know that changed.

I think we'd probably need to know more about the nature of the deal that is going on between Pearl Jam and Target before we could say anything definitively. Although I wouldn't be happy with either, just making a commercial is different than an exclusivity deal.

That being said, I'm seeing an awful lot of defense of Pearl Jam's actions (assuming they are in bed with Target, so to speak), and alot of good points have been raised, but I wonder; if the band in question had been, say, Green Day, or Radiohead, or anyone other than Pearl Jam, would we all be so quick to defend? I have a feeling that alot of those who are defending PJ now would be willing to raise the pitchforks otherwise. And it's understandable, since it is a Pearl Jam board, but it still makes little sense.

It is very possible, for a large band to make money and push product without having to resort to exclusivity deals. We see it all the time; Radiohead and Nine Inch Nails are both oft-used examples, but that is because they are good ones. There is no necessity to go into an exclusivity deal because the majority of big bands do not. Why would you do it? To make more money and ensure a favorable end result. It might be a smart business move (PJ's album sales, as we all know, have not been the greatest this decade, especially in comparison to their surefire stature as a dependable moneymaker live), but would it be right?

I'd be the last one to say that people should not be allowed to make money; Pearl Jam has every right to make smart business moves. But when they make deals that contradict ideals they have publically stood for for quite a long time, there is a hint of hypocrisy to that. Pearl Jam and Eddie have long been anti-corporate, in song, word and deed; us fans did not make that up out of thin air. Although the music is what brought us all here and keeps us all here, I think all of us would admit that the band's integrity in how they conducted their affairs was extremely attractive. It was laudable, and made me realize that I could become a popular musician without necessarily sacrificing my ideals if I wanted. A hypothetical move like this (again, I'm talking primarily about an exclusivity deal), which would hurt independent record stores (something Eddie has tirelessly championed), and benefit a corporate behemoth is simply not in line with how the band's career has mostly been conducted with the past. I'm not saying they are 'selling out'; personally I think the term is overused and tired. However, I can't understand those making the argument that a deal with Target is in line with the ideals the band has made central in the past.

I'm still stealing it. Oh no!

I think most artists from Seattle know what there doing. It's not like anyone from there made a pop album and has video with dancers and rappers in it now.

assuming the Target thing is true, how is it any different than them signing a deal with an "exclusive" record label? usually they would sign with one label which would then distribute/promote the album. in this case, they cut out the middle man (record company) it seems.

am I wrong?

maybe they'll rake in a ton of cash with this alleged target deal that will then allow them to lower their ticket prices for the upcoming tour to support the record.


i won't hold my breath..

Yeah I am thinking along the lines of this.


I don't think of it as selling out.

The primary thing it would do is be extremely detrimental to independent music stores. An exclusivity deal would mean that the album would only be available in one location, one chain of stores. That means everyone else would be out of luck. Those who support independent music stores worry that increased exclusivity deals with large chains will lead to their extinction. No matter what record company PJ is on, they'd be available in all types of stores.

Additionally, benefitting one corporation like Target would be additionally detrimental to other mom-and-pop stores, the same ones that are being hurt now. Of course, one could say that it's evolution, baby; the smaller stores are on their way out anyway, so what does it matter? However, alot of people to think it is hurting both the American economy and culture, and PJ, according to their actions and music, presumably agree with that.

they will never lower ticket prices. that is where bands make their money