Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:02 pm
Yeah Yeah Yeah
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 2:48 pm Posts: 3115 Location: Edinburgh/Lincoln, UK
Patrick Bateman wrote:
cutuphalfdead wrote:
Also, RA and Binaural are both much stronger albums than S/T is.
RA much stronger ? Fuck no.
I don't think the inital point was about the songs, as much as the realisations of the concepts and themes of the albums. I'd take Binaural over S/T, but I do think that S/T is a more cohesive album, and largely because Ed is writing (pretty much all of the lyrics), so he's steering the ship. There is a general consensus here that Binaural and Riot Act are albums that could have been far better than they were...but because of 'democratic principles', or lack of leadership, or whatever you want to call it, they became cluttered and less focussed than they could have been (I know this is subjective, but it can be justified by the amount of attention the retracking-albums threads get). People don't talk about the other albums in this way.
Last edited by iceagecoming on Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 10:46 pm
Global Moderator
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:02 am Posts: 44183 Location: New York Gender: Male
do people think the democracy in lyric writing/song choice on yield hurt that album's cohesion? I'd say yes, but I'm not sure others would agree
_________________ "Better the occasional faults of a Government that lives in a spirit of charity than the consistent omissions of a Government frozen in the ice of its own indifference."--FDR
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 10:55 pm
Master of Meh
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 11:00 pm Posts: 13226 Location: Adelaide, AUS
iceagecoming wrote:
mastaflatch wrote:
Patrick Bateman wrote:
cutuphalfdead wrote:
Also, RA and Binaural are both much stronger albums than S/T is.
RA much stronger ? Fuck no.
as far as focus is concerned, S/T wins over Binuarl and RA, although it could have been much better/more inspired from beginning to end.
Yup. And thinking this doesn't mean you have to like S/T more necessarily.
I'd like to see an argument for how Binaural or Riot Act are more focussed than S/T...
I'd agree that S/T is more focused than either Binaural or Riot Act, however I find Riot Act so much more likeable than either of them. It's the only post-Yield album I'd ever put on just for fun; it's no masterpiece, just a collection of good to occasionally great songs (but never, ever uninteresting) that don't really have any flow together but don't try too hard to pretend that they do.
Every time I put it on I'm pleasantly surprised how enjoyable it is. I would be very satisfied if they kept churning out stuff like that, unfortunately I think it'll be another few albums til they get that lazily experimental, throw-everything-at-the-wall-and-see-what-sticks spirit back again (if ever).
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 11:15 pm
Unthought Known
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2006 4:33 am Posts: 8422 Location: Berthier-sur-Mer Gender: Male
stip wrote:
do people think the democracy in lyric writing/song choice on yield hurt that album's cohesion? I'd say yes, but I'm not sure others would agree
i think that on Yield they managed to aim in the same direction lyrically (idk about that Ismael thing...what is it about?) and at the time i bought the album (on the day it came out), it happened to fit perfectly with what i was going through. not sure about Pilate though - i don't really care what it's about, but i like the music to it. i guess you have no choice but to establish a certain theme/approach to lyricists if you want an album to hold together. i mean, not everybody fits well together as the Beatles did. Eddie, Stone, Matt and Jeff are REALLY different when it comes to lyrics, both in style and quality.
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 11:38 pm
Force of Nature
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 1:30 pm Posts: 918 Location: Miami Gender: Male
If anything, Eddie is the dude in the band who is still consistently writing what I want. I dig his current level of fame. Known as fuck, but I don't have to hear about him on people's twitter accounts.
_________________
Angus wrote:
Sleater-Kinney is a gift from God to mankind. Then that gift was taken away again because mankind was too stupid to realize how kind God was to give mankind such beautiful present.
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 12:16 am
Global Moderator
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:02 am Posts: 44183 Location: New York Gender: Male
I'm kind of surprised people don't see any cohesion in riot act.
Mastaflatch--Yield has VERY little to actually do with Ishmael outside of DTE
_________________ "Better the occasional faults of a Government that lives in a spirit of charity than the consistent omissions of a Government frozen in the ice of its own indifference."--FDR
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 12:26 am
Dave A's Slave
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 9:19 am Posts: 728 Location: Island Continent Gender: Male
I think that in terms of lyrics (whether they be quality or not) Riot Act is perhaps the most cohesive album the band has put together. But for me the music isn't good enough to back that up and I personally cannot listen to Riot from start to finish. They only way i have come to enjoy it is to create an alternate track list, cut the crap of the album and insert songs that should have been there. Yeild on the other hand has very little lyrical cohesion in term of hte lyrics joinging together to tell a story or to fit an overriding theme. The music on the otherhand has the same tone, the same feel, perhaps becuase of the great production.
_________________ Vedder’s sticking with the underdog, McCready’s classicist rock solo, Gossard, Ament, and Abbruzzese’s solid yet organic and rootsy rhythm section. It’s earnest, it’s got tension, and that nod to classic rock. It’s Pearl Jam.
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 12:27 am
Stone's Bitch
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 1:53 am Posts: 1435 Location: in fashion, the soft drinks, expansion Gender: Male
stip wrote:
I'm kind of surprised people don't see any cohesion in riot act.
Mastaflatch--Yield has VERY little to actually do with Ishmael outside of DTE
well, if you believe the guys (look at me calling them "the guys," i'm an asshole) they all were coming from the headspace of Daniel Quinn during the recording of Yield, so maybe it seeped into the process?
Yes. I think I'm right.
_________________ I like rhythmic things that butt up against each other in a cool kind of way.
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:14 am
Force of Nature
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2005 9:48 pm Posts: 820
cutuphalfdead wrote:
VAN wrote:
I haven't read the entire thread but just wanted to put my twon sense in. I really think any problems with the recent records has to do with Eddie not taking full control over the album. S/T was the best in recent years becuase Eddie wrote most of the lyrics and that album had a much more cohesion. My main problem with the album in Inside Job and Ed, of course didn't write it and that's why it doesn't fit.
Again, if you look at Binaural and Riot Act, look at all the Eddie songs and you can see the album that it was trying to do be/should have been. If you add Sad, Fatal, & Education to the mix of Parting Ways, Insignifiance and Sleight of Hand, there is much more of a clearer vision both lyrically and musically. The collaberation worked with Yield becuase it fits with the sentiments of the song.
Eddie can easliy write the album I want, Into the Wild proved that. I'm not really impressed with the Backspacer lyrics thus far but the songs and melodies themselves are very promising.
So what's wrong with Yield? That was the most democratic album and many say it's the best. Also, RA and Binaural are both much stronger albums than S/T is.
Disagree with the last part. RA is the laziest PJ album and Binaural is the worst realized. To me, Yield works becuase everyone brought their A-game and when I think of that album I think of the description given by Ed/Stone in SVT about yielding to another. Of course it's all up to preference, it simply worked best here in my opinion. I think it's just one of those things were the band were all in similar places in their lives and interesting in similar things and it comes through. Ed and Jeff were reading Ishmael, for example.
This is one of the reasons I'm not concerend about a short, 11 track Backspacer. We dont' need as many songs as they can cram together which results in another Down "not fitting in." I have retracked RA and Binaural many times and came up with what are much better, consistent 11 track playlists.
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:23 am
Force of Nature
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2005 9:48 pm Posts: 820
stip wrote:
I'm kind of surprised people don't see any cohesion in riot act.
Mastaflatch--Yield has VERY little to actually do with Ishmael outside of DTE
I can see lyrical cohesion and I'm not sure why I like RA the least. I think it's just too dark to listen to and I lay this is Eddie totally. He sounds so defeated and that's hard to listen to. It's probally a great record in the sense that it is emotionally honest. This band has always been honest, which is why I am still so interested in them. That record came out of a dark time and I guess it would be dishonest to have a uplifting record. Even on the studio version of Down, he sounds like he's faking it, compared to live versions.
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:45 am
Unthought Known
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2006 4:33 am Posts: 8422 Location: Berthier-sur-Mer Gender: Male
stip wrote:
I'm kind of surprised people don't see any cohesion in riot act.
i should read your guided tour with more attention
i mean, i can see some kind of cohesion in the lyrics on some songs but here's where this democracy/monarchy (oligarchy?) doesn't work: cropduster ghost thumbing my way (i know this one's a many fan's favorite but i hate it) you are (i know this one's a many fan's favorite but i hate it) get right what do these songs have to do with the others? give me vitalogy's "filler" tracks over these any day. music is not (only) about the lyrics, in fact, it's often more eloquent and communicative when there's no lyrics at all. that's why, to me, Vitalogy is their best - it's an album that takes its time and brings unusual images in the mind of casual PJ fans, it's also daring, like No Code and Yield were afterwards. Binuarl is a bunch of songs for better and worse, as is RA imo. S/T is more focused yet it loses its breath halfway through. still a step in the good direction.
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 4:34 am
Global Moderator
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:02 am Posts: 44183 Location: New York Gender: Male
VAN wrote:
stip wrote:
I'm kind of surprised people don't see any cohesion in riot act.
Mastaflatch--Yield has VERY little to actually do with Ishmael outside of DTE
I can see lyrical cohesion and I'm not sure why I like RA the least. I think it's just too dark to listen to and I lay this is Eddie totally. He sounds so defeated and that's hard to listen to. It's probally a great record in the sense that it is emotionally honest. This band has always been honest, which is why I am still so interested in them. That record came out of a dark time and I guess it would be dishonest to have a uplifting record. Even on the studio version of Down, he sounds like he's faking it, compared to live versions.
hey, a record can have cohesion and still not be very good or enjoyable
_________________ "Better the occasional faults of a Government that lives in a spirit of charity than the consistent omissions of a Government frozen in the ice of its own indifference."--FDR
Post subject: Re: Is Eddie too famous to write the album you want?
Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 12:19 am
Force of Nature
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 7:56 pm Posts: 345 Location: Planet Cardinal Gender: Male
I can't wait until 2-3 years from now when everyone is clamoring for a return to form like the sound PJ had way back in the awesome days of '06 and the S/T LP. It's going to happen. Most of the fans dissed Yield, Binaural and Riot Act when they came out for a variety of reasons. Now, everyone loves them. Know what? They were great when they came out and they're even better now. And S/T is a damn good rock LP put out by a band in its 16th year of existence and still sounds fresh and new and rocking three years later. Ed's songwriting skills are in fine form, too. Who else in the rock world could sing "Life Wasted" and also write "Comeback" and "Severed Hand?" No one.
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