Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:09 am Posts: 2482 Location: Averill Park, NY
Someone explain to my why this guy isn't considered one of the best pitchers in baseball, if not the best. The guy has a record of like 93-39 lifetime and has an ERA under 1 for this year. I think he was always overlooked in Oakland as just a part of a trio because of Zito and Mulder and it looks like he's being overlooked in Atlanta because of Smoltz. I'd totally take Tim Hudson over Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Kevin Brown and he's making like, what, a third as much money?
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 1:51 pm Posts: 4329 Location: PA
He's pitching great. It's a shame he isn't 3-0. Kolb blew a save in his second game and Braves couldn't score last night. No one in baseball is throwing better.
_________________
emanon wrote:
I think I either need to drink less to become more alert, or more so as not to care.
Someone explain to my why this guy isn't considered one of the best pitchers in baseball, if not the best. The guy has a record of like 93-39 lifetime and has an ERA under 1 for this year. I think he was always overlooked in Oakland as just a part of a trio because of Zito and Mulder and it looks like he's being overlooked in Atlanta because of Smoltz. I'd totally take Tim Hudson over Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Kevin Brown and he's making like, what, a third as much money?
wow..you'd REALLY take him over Kevin Brown? You're really going out on a limb there
_________________ “You’re good kids, stay together. Trust each other and be good teammates to one another. I believe there is a championship in this room.”
-Ernie Accorsi in his final address to the NY Giants locker room before retiring as GM in January of 2007
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 12:47 pm Posts: 9282 Location: Atlanta Gender: Male
Just Justin wrote:
Someone explain to my why this guy isn't considered one of the best pitchers in baseball, if not the best. The guy has a record of like 93-39 lifetime and has an ERA under 1 for this year. I think he was always overlooked in Oakland as just a part of a trio because of Zito and Mulder and it looks like he's being overlooked in Atlanta because of Smoltz. I'd totally take Tim Hudson over Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Kevin Brown and he's making like, what, a third as much money?
He's not being overlooked, he's just pitching in that slot because it fit the rotation better the way Cox sees it. He's easily the best pitcher in Atlanta, maybe the best in the last 15 seasons. He's got Maddux in his prime type stuff with a better fastball. If it were the post season he'd be #1 although Smoltz is one of the best big game pitchers of all time IMHO.
To bad for him the Braves have a terrible offensive team, and thier bullpen includes the likes of Tom Martin.
It's an unbelievable help having Smoltz close games out for you, Dan Kolb isn't on the same level and he knows it......thus far that's been his problem.
Thankfully for us Sosa pitched well last night Kolb got a save (though he is still struggling with his control) and Reitsma looks like he might actually do ok.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 12:25 am Posts: 11849 Location: west coast
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
Just Justin wrote:
Someone explain to my why this guy isn't considered one of the best pitchers in baseball, if not the best. The guy has a record of like 93-39 lifetime and has an ERA under 1 for this year. I think he was always overlooked in Oakland as just a part of a trio because of Zito and Mulder and it looks like he's being overlooked in Atlanta because of Smoltz. I'd totally take Tim Hudson over Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Kevin Brown and he's making like, what, a third as much money?
wow..you'd REALLY take him over Kevin Brown? You're really going out on a limb there
_________________ I was unsure what to do; I'd never seen a girl choke on dick before. I thought that only happened in rap songs.
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 10:59 am Posts: 9057 Location: Camden, NJ
Electromatic wrote:
Just Justin wrote:
Someone explain to my why this guy isn't considered one of the best pitchers in baseball, if not the best. The guy has a record of like 93-39 lifetime and has an ERA under 1 for this year. I think he was always overlooked in Oakland as just a part of a trio because of Zito and Mulder and it looks like he's being overlooked in Atlanta because of Smoltz. I'd totally take Tim Hudson over Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Kevin Brown and he's making like, what, a third as much money?
He's not being overlooked, he's just pitching in that slot because it fit the rotation better the way Cox sees it. He's easily the best pitcher in Atlanta, maybe the best in the last 15 seasons. He's got Maddux in his prime type stuff with a better fastball. If it were the post season he'd be #1 although Smoltz is one of the best big game pitchers of all time IMHO.
To bad for him the Braves have a terrible offensive team, and thier bullpen includes the likes of Tom Martin.
It's an unbelievable help having Smoltz close games out for you, Dan Kolb isn't on the same level and he knows it......thus far that's been his problem.
Thankfully for us Sosa pitched well last night Kolb got a save (though he is still struggling with his control) and Reitsma looks like he might actually do ok.
holy shit you guys STILL have Tom Martin???? That guy was thee biggest loser in LA, maybe the worst middle reliever in recent LA history! sorry dude, you deserve better!
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 12:47 pm Posts: 9282 Location: Atlanta Gender: Male
PJguy23 wrote:
Electromatic wrote:
Just Justin wrote:
Someone explain to my why this guy isn't considered one of the best pitchers in baseball, if not the best. The guy has a record of like 93-39 lifetime and has an ERA under 1 for this year. I think he was always overlooked in Oakland as just a part of a trio because of Zito and Mulder and it looks like he's being overlooked in Atlanta because of Smoltz. I'd totally take Tim Hudson over Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Kevin Brown and he's making like, what, a third as much money?
He's not being overlooked, he's just pitching in that slot because it fit the rotation better the way Cox sees it. He's easily the best pitcher in Atlanta, maybe the best in the last 15 seasons. He's got Maddux in his prime type stuff with a better fastball. If it were the post season he'd be #1 although Smoltz is one of the best big game pitchers of all time IMHO.
To bad for him the Braves have a terrible offensive team, and thier bullpen includes the likes of Tom Martin.
It's an unbelievable help having Smoltz close games out for you, Dan Kolb isn't on the same level and he knows it......thus far that's been his problem.
Thankfully for us Sosa pitched well last night Kolb got a save (though he is still struggling with his control) and Reitsma looks like he might actually do ok.
holy shit you guys STILL have Tom Martin???? That guy was thee biggest loser in LA, maybe the worst middle reliever in recent LA history! sorry dude, you deserve better!
yeah, we had Mark Remlinger who was golden down here, Time Warner cut payroll and we wind up with Tom Martin. He just carries a can of gas to the mound with him when he pitches and douses himself.
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:04 pm Posts: 1954 Location: birmingham, al Gender: Male
Mitchell wrote:
The test will be if Hudson's small frame can pitch for a long time and win 250+ games.
How is that a "test". He dominated at Auburn now he is a top five pitcher in the big leagues. If he never pitched another game I think he has past any test.
The reason he is pitching in this spot in the rotation is because Cox used him the last day of spring training. Cox did not want to use Hudson on three days rest.
Hudson got no run support in Oakland now he is getting no support in Atlanta. There is no telling what his record would be if he had some offense.
The test will be if Hudson's small frame can pitch for a long time and win 250+ games.
Quote:
If he never pitched another game I think he has past any test.
if he never pitches another game, then he obviously won't have passed the longevity test, which is what the original poster was alluding too.
Also, nobody gives a f--k about what he did at Auburn.
Quote:
Hudson got no run support in Oakland
yeah, guys like Giambi, Tejada, Chavez really had a hard time putting runs up.
_________________ “You’re good kids, stay together. Trust each other and be good teammates to one another. I believe there is a championship in this room.”
-Ernie Accorsi in his final address to the NY Giants locker room before retiring as GM in January of 2007
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:04 pm Posts: 1954 Location: birmingham, al Gender: Male
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
aubiejam wrote:
Mitchell wrote:
The test will be if Hudson's small frame can pitch for a long time and win 250+ games.
Quote:
If he never pitched another game I think he has past any test.
if he never pitches another game, then he obviously won't have passed the longevity test, which is what the original poster was alluding too.
Also, nobody gives a f--k about what he did at Auburn.
Quote:
Hudson got no run support in Oakland
yeah, guys like Giambi, Tejada, Chavez really had a hard time putting runs up.
I know what the original poster was alluding too. My point is that most pitchers in the majors don't spend four years in college where college coaches abuse their aces by throwing them a ton. I don't have time to pull up his run support while with the A's, but I have followed his career pretty close. But I guess you don't give a f....
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 10:59 am Posts: 9057 Location: Camden, NJ
Electromatic wrote:
PJguy23 wrote:
Electromatic wrote:
Just Justin wrote:
Someone explain to my why this guy isn't considered one of the best pitchers in baseball, if not the best. The guy has a record of like 93-39 lifetime and has an ERA under 1 for this year. I think he was always overlooked in Oakland as just a part of a trio because of Zito and Mulder and it looks like he's being overlooked in Atlanta because of Smoltz. I'd totally take Tim Hudson over Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Kevin Brown and he's making like, what, a third as much money?
He's not being overlooked, he's just pitching in that slot because it fit the rotation better the way Cox sees it. He's easily the best pitcher in Atlanta, maybe the best in the last 15 seasons. He's got Maddux in his prime type stuff with a better fastball. If it were the post season he'd be #1 although Smoltz is one of the best big game pitchers of all time IMHO.
To bad for him the Braves have a terrible offensive team, and thier bullpen includes the likes of Tom Martin.
It's an unbelievable help having Smoltz close games out for you, Dan Kolb isn't on the same level and he knows it......thus far that's been his problem.
Thankfully for us Sosa pitched well last night Kolb got a save (though he is still struggling with his control) and Reitsma looks like he might actually do ok.
holy shit you guys STILL have Tom Martin???? That guy was thee biggest loser in LA, maybe the worst middle reliever in recent LA history! sorry dude, you deserve better!
yeah, we had Mark Remlinger who was golden down here, Time Warner cut payroll and we wind up with Tom Martin. He just carries a can of gas to the mound with him when he pitches and douses himself.
I think his ERA on the year is 135.
goddamnit right now ID take Martin back....Dodger bullpen is CRA Pso far this year...Elmer Dessens lasted 3 innings today, and then this garbage Buddy Carlyle came in and promptly gave up 4 runs, giving him 5ER in 7IP...Dodger bullpen is in serious perile till GAME OVER gets healthy
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 12:59 am Posts: 18643 Location: Raleigh, NC Gender: Male
PJguy aren't the Dodgers 8-2? Might as well ride the hot streak and be happy with it dude.
Regarding Hudson, I was at the Coliseum for most of his starts in his rookie year. He was nails then and he's nails now. He doesn't get as much credit as others because his strikeout count isn't gaudy, his personality is quiet, and he had to share the spotlight with others. He's similar to Tom Glavine in those respects.
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 10:59 am Posts: 9057 Location: Camden, NJ
Athletic Supporter wrote:
PJguy aren't the Dodgers 8-2? Might as well ride the hot streak and be happy with it dude.
Regarding Hudson, I was at the Coliseum for most of his starts in his rookie year. He was nails then and he's nails now. He doesn't get as much credit as others because his strikeout count isn't gaudy, his personality is quiet, and he had to share the spotlight with others. He's similar to Tom Glavine in those respects.
10-2 as of this morning, but for some fucked up reason LA leads the league in runs scored. you KNOW that wont last much longer, and their bullpen is going to cost them some games once the dodgers get into some real pitchers duels and one run games....LA was down 6-0 today, right now its 6-5 in the 7th, but Steve Schmoll is pitching, thats right, STEVE SCHMOLL!!!! I am not confident, no dodger fan would be about this bunch....l
ast year at this time the bullpen was automatic. Driefort 6th, Dirty Duaner Sanchez in the 7th, Mota 8th, and gagne would close it out. Now its a struggle to get to Yhency Brazebon in the 9th, and even HE was looking rough so far. we neeeeeeed Gagne to come back like NOW!
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 12:47 pm Posts: 9282 Location: Atlanta Gender: Male
Athletic Supporter wrote:
PJguy aren't the Dodgers 8-2? Might as well ride the hot streak and be happy with it dude.
Regarding Hudson, I was at the Coliseum for most of his starts in his rookie year. He was nails then and he's nails now. He doesn't get as much credit as others because his strikeout count isn't gaudy, his personality is quiet, and he had to share the spotlight with others. He's similar to Tom Glavine in those respects.
He's a lot like Glavine, yeah early in the 90's. I'm sure he's just as glad to have Andrew Jones shagging flys out there too.
Now if only he could hit to the opposite field and they could score Hudson some runs and have the bullpen not blow it........
can't have it all I guess.
Last edited by Electromatic on Tue Apr 19, 2005 8:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:09 am Posts: 2482 Location: Averill Park, NY
PJguy23 wrote:
Electromatic wrote:
PJguy23 wrote:
Electromatic wrote:
Just Justin wrote:
Someone explain to my why this guy isn't considered one of the best pitchers in baseball, if not the best. The guy has a record of like 93-39 lifetime and has an ERA under 1 for this year. I think he was always overlooked in Oakland as just a part of a trio because of Zito and Mulder and it looks like he's being overlooked in Atlanta because of Smoltz. I'd totally take Tim Hudson over Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens, Kevin Brown and he's making like, what, a third as much money?
He's not being overlooked, he's just pitching in that slot because it fit the rotation better the way Cox sees it. He's easily the best pitcher in Atlanta, maybe the best in the last 15 seasons. He's got Maddux in his prime type stuff with a better fastball. If it were the post season he'd be #1 although Smoltz is one of the best big game pitchers of all time IMHO.
To bad for him the Braves have a terrible offensive team, and thier bullpen includes the likes of Tom Martin.
It's an unbelievable help having Smoltz close games out for you, Dan Kolb isn't on the same level and he knows it......thus far that's been his problem.
Thankfully for us Sosa pitched well last night Kolb got a save (though he is still struggling with his control) and Reitsma looks like he might actually do ok.
holy shit you guys STILL have Tom Martin???? That guy was thee biggest loser in LA, maybe the worst middle reliever in recent LA history! sorry dude, you deserve better!
yeah, we had Mark Remlinger who was golden down here, Time Warner cut payroll and we wind up with Tom Martin. He just carries a can of gas to the mound with him when he pitches and douses himself.
I think his ERA on the year is 135.
goddamnit right now ID take Martin back....Dodger bullpen is CRA Pso far this year...Elmer Dessens lasted 3 innings today, and then this garbage Buddy Carlyle came in and promptly gave up 4 runs, giving him 5ER in 7IP...Dodger bullpen is in serious perile till GAME OVER gets healthy
The Braves actually released him after his bad outing(s) for them. He was scheduled to make like 2 million. So, technically, he could go back to the Dodgers.
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