Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 2:12 pm
Yeah Yeah Yeah
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:23 am Posts: 4187
spenno wrote:
TheDapperGent wrote:
is their some animosity between certain members that is blocking out creativity?
Not that I think it's necessarily the root cause of their declining creative powers, but if anything the absence of any interpersonal tension might be one factor. Lots of great bands, this one included, made their best music when they were falling apart on a personal level.
I'm more inclined to think they just ran their course in a creative sense. They had a good eight to ten years or so of consistent excellence, that's certainly more than most bands.
Even if i totally agree with you, i think they did have their issues through only 2 records, vitalogy and no code. When they did riot act and binaural, they didnt seemed to have any internal issues at all, maybe mike´s addiction. So im not sure how this apply to pearl jam compared with other bands like, lets say...the smiths, pink floyd, or the pixies.
spenno wrote:
Unemployable is a great song.
Its very good and very different from what they were doing at the time. When Riot Act came out, there was some intention to have mike playing solos again, but the music seemed to have a more pop feeling, even if the whole record sounded kinda dark. With Unemployable they went further with that sound, and it really pays off. Matt´s work here is superb. I remember a lot of people being really turned off with this one when it came out as a b side, because of this pop sound and eddie´s vocals.
Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 5:56 pm
Red Mosquito, my libido
Joined: Sun May 21, 2006 2:02 am Posts: 91597 Location: Sector 7-G
Angus wrote:
theplatypus wrote:
I'm not really a big fan of that approach for Pearl Jam-- I like them better when there is a foreboding darkness, a mystery to their music, which is why I love that Vitalogy-through-Riot Act stretch of albums so much.
Very well said indeed.
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Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 7:01 pm
Banned from the Pit
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:45 pm Posts: 34 Gender: Male
cutuphalfdead wrote:
Angus wrote:
theplatypus wrote:
I'm not really a big fan of that approach for Pearl Jam-- I like them better when there is a foreboding darkness, a mystery to their music, which is why I love that Vitalogy-through-Riot Act stretch of albums so much.
Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 10:27 pm
Supersonic
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 3:07 pm Posts: 12393
Except that both of those songs are adequate at best.
Thin Air at least gains from the production...which is all it takes to place it above Gone. If any band or songwriter who wasn't currently stumbling in terms of songwriting had written it, it would be a footnote.
Figuring how Gone made the last single is a lot like "how many licks does it take to wake Lexi Diamond up after a solid coke binge?"
Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 10:31 pm
Coast to Coast
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2007 6:21 am Posts: 23078 Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina Gender: Male
I can't even begin to formulate how much I disagree with the notion that "Thin Air" and "Gone" are anywhere close to each other in terms of quality. "Thin Air" is a understated and beautiful song with a thoughtful arrangement and evocative lyrics, "Gone" is a lifeless dirge.
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Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 10:47 pm
Got Some
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2006 1:37 am Posts: 2465 Location: A dark place
I agree they are nothing alike, but both are bad. I never like the lyrics to Thin Air. I don't like the overly direct sentiment of the chorus mixed with some of the more abstract elements of some of the verses. I know Pearl Jam has mixed the two before, I just don't think it's done well here. Perhaps it's because Stone wrote the lyrics. The music is also uninspired, particularly the whole "take it on, on, on, on" bridge. I never understood why this song made it on to Binaural. If it was a band "democracy" thing and another Stone song was needed, why not Fatal? It would have fit the mood of the album better anyway. Thin Air is really the only song on Binaural that I skip.
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Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 10:50 pm
Yeah Yeah Yeah
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:23 am Posts: 4187
turned2black wrote:
I agree they are nothing alike, but both are bad. I never like the lyrics to Thin Air. I don't like the overly direct sentiment of the chorus mixed with some of the more abstract elements of some of the verses. I know Pearl Jam has mixed the two before, I just don't think it's done well here. Perhaps it's because Stone wrote the lyrics. The music is also uninspired, particularly the whole "take it on, on, on, on" bridge. I never understood why this song made it on to Binaural. If it was a band "democracy" thing and another Stone song was needed, why not Fatal? It would have fit the mood of the album better anyway. Thin Air is really the only song on Binaural that I skip.
Thin Air is actually a great song...one of the finest moments of a great but difficult record like Binaural. Lyrically is fucking awesome...it could be about a lot of things. Great song.
Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:05 pm
statistically insignificant
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2008 10:19 pm Posts: 25134
VinylGuy wrote:
turned2black wrote:
I agree they are nothing alike, but both are bad. I never like the lyrics to Thin Air. I don't like the overly direct sentiment of the chorus mixed with some of the more abstract elements of some of the verses. I know Pearl Jam has mixed the two before, I just don't think it's done well here. Perhaps it's because Stone wrote the lyrics. The music is also uninspired, particularly the whole "take it on, on, on, on" bridge. I never understood why this song made it on to Binaural. If it was a band "democracy" thing and another Stone song was needed, why not Fatal? It would have fit the mood of the album better anyway. Thin Air is really the only song on Binaural that I skip.
Thin Air is actually a great song...one of the finest moments of a great but difficult record like Binaural. Lyrically is fucking awesome...it could be about a lot of things. Great song.
have you ever found anything PJ-related you refused to laud
Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:11 pm
Coast to Coast
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2007 6:21 am Posts: 23078 Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina Gender: Male
turned2black wrote:
I agree they are nothing alike, but both are bad. I never like the lyrics to Thin Air. I don't like the overly direct sentiment of the chorus mixed with some of the more abstract elements of some of the verses. I know Pearl Jam has mixed the two before, I just don't think it's done well here. Perhaps it's because Stone wrote the lyrics. The music is also uninspired, particularly the whole "take it on, on, on, on" bridge. I never understood why this song made it on to Binaural. If it was a band "democracy" thing and another Stone song was needed, why not Fatal? It would have fit the mood of the album better anyway. Thin Air is really the only song on Binaural that I skip.
I actually think it fits Binaural perfectly. It's pretty simplistic musically (but so is "Fatal") because it's a country ballad at heart, albeit a somber one. I really love the arrangement-- the sunny-sounding guitar harmony after the chorus contrasting with the ominousness of the D-A chord change, reflecting the uncertainty and apprehension in the lyrics. I love the middle 8. I think they nailed it by playing it straight and vulnerable rather than forcing a new chord progression. Instead, they worked in a really nice and subtle pivot chord modulation for the final chorus, heightening the drama of it. I love it. It's not a "major" accomplishment-- like McP puts it, it is very much a footnote-- but I think it's a really ingenious little song, full of trope subversions.
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Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:21 pm
Banned from the Pit
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2012 5:14 pm Posts: 52 Location: Gulfport, MS Gender: Male
I hate to break it to you but the two songs have pretty much the same chords. I know thin air is in E and Gone is in C but they both have a similar feel to me.
I love binaural its a top 3 PJ album for me but I'll only listen to thin air every now and then. As McParadigm said at least thin air benefits from it's production.
S/T on the other hand is a bottom 3 PJ album for me and I skip over Gone every single time, I quit trying to give that song a chance to grow on me. Total snoozer of a song with an uninteresting melody.
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Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:21 pm
Got Some
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2006 1:37 am Posts: 2465 Location: A dark place
VinylGuy wrote:
turned2black wrote:
I agree they are nothing alike, but both are bad. I never like the lyrics to Thin Air. I don't like the overly direct sentiment of the chorus mixed with some of the more abstract elements of some of the verses. I know Pearl Jam has mixed the two before, I just don't think it's done well here. Perhaps it's because Stone wrote the lyrics. The music is also uninspired, particularly the whole "take it on, on, on, on" bridge. I never understood why this song made it on to Binaural. If it was a band "democracy" thing and another Stone song was needed, why not Fatal? It would have fit the mood of the album better anyway. Thin Air is really the only song on Binaural that I skip.
Thin Air is actually a great song...one of the finest moments of a great but difficult record like Binaural. Lyrically is fucking awesome...it could be about a lot of things. Great song.
I don't really know how to respond to this, because you didn't really give me anything to go on. I will say, lyrically it's not great. There are a lot of ham-fisted lines like: "there's a light when my baby's in my arms" "hesitate when i feel i may do harm to her wash it off cuz this feeling we can share" "how to be happy and true is the quest we're taking on together" "love can keep on moving in both directions"
then those mixed with the more abstract: "byzantine is reflected in our pond there's a cloud but the water remains calm reaching in, the sun's fingers clutch the dawn to pass even out, it's a precious thing to bear"
I just don't think they pair well together.
It's a shame, because I do think Ed's vocal delivery is great for the most part. Unfortunately, he's delivering bad lyrics. And, again, I find the music tedious and uninspired.
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Post subject: Re: Lets Actually Listen to the Albums: S/T Edition
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:22 pm
Yeah Yeah Yeah
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:37 am Posts: 3819
theplatypus is talking some serious sense here.
There are so many cool things going on in "Thin Air" compositionally that aren't entirely evident from the unassuming breeziness of the arrangement. Of course, that doesn't necessarily signify that it's a good song, but I find the circular shape of the song extremely satisfying. It's a great example of how a song can achieve complex tensions by taking a few run-of-the-mill open chords that don't belong together and making them go together.
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