Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:19 pm Posts: 39068 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA Gender: Male
Quote:
Flag Burning Never let it be said that Congress does nothing useful. Why, it looks like the Senate is within a vote or two of passing a constitutional amendment to ban flag burning. That ought to put an end to the rampant and widespread flag desecration going on in this country:
Quote:
Scenes of foreigners burning American flags may be common on TV, but such desecration is rare in this country. The Citizens Flag Alliance, an advocacy group that supports a constitutional amendment, reports a decline in flag desecration incidents, with only one this year.
But it's one too many, no doubt! Here's a question though. Orrin Hatch (R-UT) says we need to put an end to flag-burning because it's "offensive conduct." Right you are, Mr. Hatch. As is, by the way, flying the Confederate flag. So how many Senators want to take up a ban on the ol' "Southern Cross," do you think? Oh, right. Thought so.
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
Vote on flag desecration may be 'cliffhanger' [img]By Andrea Stone, USA TODAY Wed Jun 15, 7:00 AM ET[/img]
The Senate may be within one or two votes of passing a constitutional amendment to ban desecration of the U.S. flag, clearing the way for ratification by the states, a key opponent of the measure said Tuesday.
"It's scary close," said Terri Schroeder of the American Civil Liberties Union, which opposes the amendment. "People think it's something that's never going to happen. ... The reality is we're very close to losing this battle."
Congress regularly has debated the issue since the U.S. Supreme Court overturned a Texas flag desecration law in 1989 and its own Flag Protection Act the next year. But until now, it has failed to muster the two-thirds vote needed in both the House of Representatives and the Senate before states try to ratify the measure.
Next week, the House will vote on the amendment for a seventh time. If history is a guide, it will pass for a seventh time. That's when the spotlight switches to the Senate, where the amendment has always died.
But this time may be different. Amendment supporters say last year's election expanding the Senate Republican majority to 55 has buoyed their hopes for passage. Five freshmen senators - Richard Burr of North Carolina, Tom Coburn of Oklahoma, Jim DeMint of South Carolina, John Thune of South Dakota and David Vitter of Louisiana - voted for the amendment as House members and plan to do so again.
They will be joined by at least five Democrats who have co-sponsored the resolution, including Dianne Feinstein of California and Ben Nelson of Nebraska. Both are up for re-election next year.
Not all senators have publicly declared their support or opposition.
In 2000, when the Senate last took up the matter, 63 voted for the amendment, four short of a two-thirds majority.
"We're going to have deeper support for this, and the intensity is growing," Thune said Tuesday, which was Flag Day. "There's momentum."
Norm Ornstein, a political analyst at the business-oriented American Enterprise Institute for Public Policy Research, says he expects "a cliffhanger." He says Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tenn., is eager to bring up the issue, and some Democrats may be too nervous to oppose it.
Scenes of foreigners burning American flags may be common on TV, but such desecration is rare in this country. The Citizens Flag Alliance, an advocacy group that supports a constitutional amendment, reports a decline in flag desecration incidents, with only one this year.
Still, "it's important that we venerate the national symbol of our country," said Sen. Orrin Hatch (news, bio, voting record), R-Utah, the amendment's chief sponsor. "Burning, urinating, defecating on the flag - this is not speech. This is offensive conduct."
The Senate Judiciary Committee may not hold a hearing until around the July Fourth holiday, and a floor vote hasn't been scheduled.
University of Virginia political scientist Larry Sabato is skeptical about the amendment's prospects. "They may come close," he says, "but I would put good money on the likelihood that, once again, it won't be sent to the states."
If it is, though, "it is almost a foregone conclusion that the states would ratify" the amendment, says John Vile, a constitutional law expert at Middle Tennessee State University and editor of Encyclopedia of Civil Liberties in America.
Every state legislature has passed resolutions urging Congress to send them a constitutional amendment to ban flag desecration. Still, such resolutions aren't binding, and "that doesn't necessarily mean it would pass in the states," says Heather Morton, of the National Conference of State Legislatures.
A poll released last week by the Freedom Forum First Amendment Center in Nashville found 63% oppose a flag amendment, up from 53% last year.
"Clearly, more Americans are having second thoughts about using a constitutional amendment to" instill respect for the flag, said Gene Policinski, the center's executive director. "Many Americans consider it the ultimate test of a free society to permit the insult or even desecration of one of the great symbols of the nation."
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:19 pm Posts: 39068 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA Gender: Male
Athletic Supporter wrote:
Yay for extreme nationalism!
^^^ Terrorist.
_________________ "Though some may think there should be a separation between art/music and politics, it should be reinforced that art can be a form of nonviolent protest." - e.v.
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 2:18 am Posts: 3920 Location: Philadelphia
My favorite flagburning rant is of course by bill hicks...
to paraphrase... he says , flag burning... people say something like, hey, my grandfather died for that flag...really, that sucks, i got mine at kmart for 3.99, in and out, no violence....
much better than how i said it, trust me.. but that sums up how i feel.
_________________ I remember doing nothing on the night Sinatra died
And the night Jeff Buckley died
And the night Kurt Cobain died
And the night John Lennon died
I remember I stayed up to watch the news with everyone
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 4:50 pm Posts: 3955 Location: Leaving Here
I'm confused, hasn't buring the flag in this country always been a crime - what need is there for an ammendment to ban flag burning when we weren't supposed to be doing it in the first place? :confused:
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 1:14 am Posts: 37778 Location: OmaGOD!!! Gender: Male
cltaylor12 wrote:
I'm confused, hasn't buring the flag in this country always been a crime - what need is there for an ammendment to ban flag burning when we weren't supposed to be doing it in the first place? :confused:
No. A 1989 Supreme Court ruling stated that any law prohibiting the burning of the flag was a violation of the first amendment restriction free speech. So for the past 15 years, members of the Church of the Idol that is America have been trying to amend the Constitution to remedy this horrific miscarriage of justice.
_________________ Unfortunately, at the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius, the Flower Children jerked off and went back to sleep.
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 4:50 pm Posts: 3955 Location: Leaving Here
punkdavid wrote:
cltaylor12 wrote:
I'm confused, hasn't buring the flag in this country always been a crime - what need is there for an ammendment to ban flag burning when we weren't supposed to be doing it in the first place? :confused:
No. A 1989 Supreme Court ruling stated that any law prohibiting the burning of the flag was a violation of the first amendment restriction free speech. So for the past 15 years, members of the Church of the Idol that is America have been trying to amend the Constitution to remedy this horrific miscarriage of justice.
oh. Well. I suppose that is 15 years of effort well spent......
Thank you for the clarification,...so I should have burned my flag on Tuesday then, yeah?
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot post attachments in this forum