Well what do some of you republicans think about this latest survey? This reflects the way your party thinks, doesn't it concern you at all that most people voting for Bush are clearly not in command of the facts?

http://www.pipa.org

Even after the final report of Charles Duelfer to Congress saying that Iraq did not have a significant WMD program, 72% of Bush supporters continue to believe that Iraq had actual WMD (47%) or a major program for developing them (25%). Fifty-six percent assume that most experts believe Iraq had actual WMD and 57% also assume, incorrectly, that Duelfer concluded Iraq had at least a major WMD program. Kerry supporters hold opposite beliefs on all these points.

Similarly, 75% of Bush supporters continue to believe that Iraq was providing substantial support to al Qaeda, and 63% believe that clear evidence of this support has been found. Sixty percent of Bush supporters assume that this is also the conclusion of most experts, and 55% assume, incorrectly, that this was the conclusion of the 9/11 Commission. Here again, large majorities of Kerry supporters have exactly opposite perceptions.

These are some of the findings of a new study of the differing perceptions of Bush and Kerry supporters, conducted by the Program on International Policy Attitudes and Knowledge Networks, based on polls conducted in September and October.

yes
if they were open minded and capable of logic or reason they could not be conservatives then now could they?
yes they are stupid.

post of the year right here

hooray beer

seriously PJDoll, doesn't it concern you that most people voting for Bush aren't aware of some pretty basic facts regarding the war in Iraq? If Bush is re-elected isn't that kind of like he's just pulled the wool over everyone's eyes?

What we're talking about here isn't some obscure poltical point. These are basic issues that everyone should know in order to make an informed choice on November 2nd. IT's pretty clear that Bush has perpetuated several innacuracies regarding Iraq and WMD's. Doesn't that bother you at all?

please I'd like a real answer instead of sarcasm

It concerns me, but honestly, both of these guys make a living pulling the wool over everyone's eyes. Bush & the war (although I don't believe he knew the intelligence was bad at the time, but that's another discussion), Kerry and his "plan" that the rich will pay for (which is bullshit - can't happen unless we go even further into debt, which he says we won't do), both of them skirting almost every issue.

Again, no matter who you vote for, you're getting duped. Just pick the side that you know (after realizing what is bullshit and what isn't) that you think will do the things you'd like to see happen.

Finally got to Washington in the middle of the night
I couldn't wait
I headed straight for the Capitol Mall

My heart began to pound
Yahoo! It really exists
The American International Pictures logo

I looked up at that Capitol Building
Couldn't help but wonder why
I felt like saying "Hello, old friend"

Walked up the hill to touch it
Then I unzipped my pants
And pissed on it when nobody was looking

Like a great eternal Klansman
With his two flashing red eyes
Turn around he's always watching
The Washington monument pricks the sky
With flags like pubic hair ringed 'round the bottom

The symbols of our heritage
Lit up proudly in the night
Somehow fits to see the homeless people
Passed out on the lawn

So this is where it happens
The power games and bribes
All lobbying for a piece of ass

Of the stars and stripes of corruption

Makes me feel so ashamed
To be an American
When we're too stuck up to learn from our mistakes
Trying to start another Viet Nam
Like fiddling while Rome burns at home
The Boss says, "You're laid off. Blame the Japanese"

"America's back," alright
At the game it plays the worst
Strip mining the world like a slave plantation

No wonder others hate us
And the Hitlers we handpick
To bleed their people dry
For our evil empire

The drug we're fed
To make us like it
Is God and country with a band

People we know who should know better
Howl, "America riles. Let's go to war!"
Business scams are what's worth dying for.FUCK!

Are the Soviets our worst enemy?
We're destroying ourselves instead
Who cares about our civil rights
As long as I get paid?

The blind Me-Generation
Doesn't care if life's a lie

so easily used, so proud to enforce

The stars and stripes of corruption
Let's bring it all down!
Let's bring It all down!
Let's bring it all down,down,down,down,down,down!

Tell me who's the real patriots
The Archie Bunker slobs waving flags
Or the people with the guts to work
For some real change?

Rednecks and bombs don't make us strong
We loot the world, yet we can't even feed ourselves
Our real test of strength is caring
Not the war toys we sell the world

Just carry on, thankful to be farmed like worms
Old glory for a blanket
As you suck on your thumbs

Real freedom scares you
'Cause it means responsibility

So you chicken out and threaten me

Saying, "Love it or leave it"
I'll get beat up if I criticize it
You say you'll fight to the death
To save your useless flag

If you want a banana republic that bad
Then why don't you go move to one
But what can just one of us do?
Against all that money and power
Trying to crush us into roaches?

We don't destroy society in a day
Until we change ourselves first
From the inside out

We can start by not lying so much
And treating other people like dirt
It's easy not to base our lives
On how much we can scam

And you know
It feels good to lift that monkey off our back

I'm thankful I live in a place
Where I can say the things I do
Without being taken out and shot
So I'm on guard against the goons
Trying to take my rights away
We've got to rise above the need for cops and laws

Let kids learn communication
Instead of schools pushing competition
How about more art and theater instead of sports?

People will always do drugs
Let's legalize them
Crime drops when the mob can't price them
Budget's in the red
Let's tax religion

No one will do it for us
We'll just have to fix ourselves
Honesty ain't all that hard
Just put Rambo back inside your pants
Causing trouble for the system is much more fun

Thank you for the toilet paper
But your flag is meaningless to me
Look around, we're all people
Who needs countries anyway?

Our land, I love it too
I think I love it more than you
I care enough to fight

For the stars and stripes of corruption
Let's bring it all down!
Let's bring it all down!
Let's bring it all down!
If we don't try
If we just lie
If we can't find
A way to do it better than this
Who will?

ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US

That's the biggest dodge I've ever seen PJDoll. I asked for some honesty here, not the this crap, "They're both pulling the wool"

There's a major difference between Kerry talking about a PLAN to pay for something in a convoluted way that may or may not make sense and Bush and Cheney flat out LYING to people and perpetuating the LIE that Saddam and 9/11 are linked. There are 3 major deceptions Bush has promoted that now over half of his voters believe.

i guess I expected more from you. I know we don't always agree but I figured at least you'd see there's a difference here.

This post and the one above it just made history. They are now the most worthless pieces of drivel ever to make it to print, and there have been some pretty bad ones.

All hypocrisy-induced indignation aside, I must now refute the statements with actual LOGIC.

No, Republicans are not stupid. Well, they're only as stupid as Democrats are. These idiotic and biased polls only take into account this issues that Democrats feel Republicans are wrong with. Maybe many Republicans do not know the facts. But I would bet that the same percent of Democrats do not know the facts, either. As stated above, how many Democrats realize that Kerry's plans are not financially feasible within the bounds that he personally imposed upon them? Or maybe they're just ignoring it.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, your political affiliation has no correlation whatsoever on your intelligence, ignorance, or anything else. To state that it does would suggest that you yourself have not met many people of either political party or even considered the opposite viewpoint.

Well, you're wrong. I already stated, I don't believe Bush thought the intelligence was bad when he made his decision. See, I'm not one of those people that is completely outraged by the fact that we're in Iraq. I also wonder about that guy going into Iraq (can't recall his name, some Al Qaeda guy) for medical treatment. He was well received, was he not? And Saddam moving his weapons into Syria? What else do you think he moved?

If you're outraged, fine, don't vote Bush. I however see a HUGE difference between someone not fully owning up to mistakes (Bush) and somoeone flat out lying (Kerry), so which concerns me more? The flat out liar.

Never figured Id find myself agreeing with you, but I guess everyone is capable of lucid thought on occasions...

KIDDING DONT YELL!!J!:!

PJDoll you obviously did not read the survey.

The conclusions of the survey were that most people planning on voting for Bush believe incorrectly that Iraq had WMD's or a major plan for developing them. They also believed INCORRECTLY that Iraq provided substantial support to al Queda. I don't know what to say to someone that believes incorrectly that one man, Abu Musab Zarqawi, who spent a small amount of time in Iraq, constitutes a link between Iraq and al qaeda. He's not even is al Qaeda!!! He was not Well received as you put it!! There's no evidence that he had anything to do with Saddam!!!!! All our intelligence knows is just that he was in the country!!!

The 9/11 commission found no credible links between the Iraq and al qaeda.

It has nothing to do with whether or not Bush knew the intelligence was false before invading Iraq. There never was any intelligence linking Iraq to al qaeda, that's something the adminstration made up!.

As for Saddam moving his weapons to Syria, that's pure conjecture. There hasn't been proof of this yet. Come on PJDoll! This isn't funny

I'm sorry PJDoll, I don't know where you get information but it seems you're in the same group as the other people voting for Bush.

I don't know what it is with people and grouping (aka generalizing). And I don't know what is with this ridiculous belief that people are voting for Bush because they don't understand the facts. I never thought it would ever come down to this, but I will quote myself:

Oh great bearer of logic, you may have wanted to use some in your post!

Anyway, whether or not republicans are dumber than democrats isn't really the point. The point is that those voting for Bush are clearly misinformed about the facts on Iraq, the WMD's and on 9/11. It's not as if these are policy points, this is wether or not you believe something false to be true or not.

I don't see what Kerry's plan has to do with any of this. Why can't you respond to the original question? PIPA doesn't really have an agenda here, it's not a partisan poll.They ask questions about foreign policy

AT LEAST READ IT BEFORE YOU TALK

it seems the more you talk to Bush supporters about the stuff, the more you find out they clearly don't have a command of the facts. I urge you to pick up a copy of the 9/11 commission findings, it may help you clear up some of your confusion.

READ THE FUCKING SURVEY
READ THE FUCKING SURVEY
READ THE FUCKING SURVEY

PEOPLE WHO ARE VOTING FOR BUSH DO NOT HAVE A CLEAR UNDERSTANDING OF THE IRAQ/WMD/911 SITUATION

you can be an idiot and be on either side, that's not the point. However, it seems that if you hold a few of these misconceptions you do tend to vote for Bush. That's because they watch Fox News listen to Rush and Hannity and generally don't read newspapers, so they don't have a clue what's real news and what's a fucking opinion.

Your first question to me was this:

What we're talking about here isn't some obscure poltical point. These are basic issues that everyone should know in order to make an informed choice on November 2nd. IT's pretty clear that Bush has perpetuated several innacuracies regarding Iraq and WMD's. Doesn't that bother you at all?

Which is about Bush, not the survey. As far as the survey goes, ALL people are stupid. Yes, Bush supporters sound stupid in this poll because that's what they want to be true. Recycling doesn't really do any good. Did you know that? But tree hugging hippies will tell you over and over again that it's the most important thing you can do. Do they sound stupid? Yes. Are they the ones sounding smart in this poll? Yes.

All people are stupid. Remember that.

that was in response to sundevil, i responded to your posts.

I don't think all people are stupid. We've just established that two things you thought about Iraq (Zarqawi and Syria) aren't true.

Poll after poll shows that people are voting on Iraq. It just so happens that most people voting for Bush are flat out WRONG about several WMD issues and 9/11 issues. I think that's very telling if you don't even know that one of the top reasons you are voting for someone is based on a misconception.

We've had this stupid poll on the board before, and yes I've read it. And yes it is stupid to suggest that Republicans are more ignorant than Democrats. I simply said that you can find other issues that Democrats are clearly more ignorant about than Republicans.

This generalization of complete groups of people based on who they're voting for is just disgusting. It needs to end. Ignorance is on both sides.

This survey is retarded and biased, and calling republicans "stupid" or even "ignorant" is absolutely ludicrous. This kind of generalization is what causes people to not look at the facts, and it is destroying America.

When was the Zarqawi/Syria items disproven?