I just dug up some numbers to compare A-Rod, Ortiz, and Vlad. What I came up with shows that it is a lot closer between A-rod and Ortiz than some people may realize, taking away the fact that Ortiz doesn't play the field. Vlad is not even close to these two. Considering the fact that pitchers have won the MVP, you can not penalize Ortiz for not playing the field. How often do the pitchers bat, and actually play in the field?? Think about that before you decide on A-Rod because he plays in the field. If you insist on taking into consideration the fact Ortiz is only a DH, than take this fact too. A-Rod is 25th in Errors in the AL
Through September 14, 2005
Ortiz 1. HR, BB, R, SLG
2. Total Bases, and OPS
4. OBP
14. Strike Outs
15. Avg, H
A-Rod 1. R, OPS
2. HR, OBP, SLG
3. Total Bases, BB, AVG
4. SO
7. H
25. Errors
Vlad 3. SLG
5. OBP, AVG, OPS
9. HR
15. Total Bases
20. R
23. BB
29. H
122. SO
_________________ "The bigger the lie, the easier it is to believe." - Adolf Hitler
Last edited by Bant on Thu Sep 15, 2005 3:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 12:59 am Posts: 18643 Location: Raleigh, NC Gender: Male
Stripe64 wrote:
As much as I hate to admit it, it should go to A-Rod, unless he struggles and either Ortiz or Guerrero rips it up in the few remaining weeks.
Not if the Yankees miss the playoffs he shouldn't. There are viable candidates on teams that are going to be in. Vlad, Manny, and Ortiz are in a 3 way race IMO, with Vlad being my favorite.
As much as I hate to admit it, it should go to A-Rod, unless he struggles and either Ortiz or Guerrero rips it up in the few remaining weeks.
Not if the Yankees miss the playoffs he shouldn't. There are viable candidates on teams that are going to be in. Vlad, Manny, and Ortiz are in a 3 way race IMO, with Vlad being my favorite.
Making the playoffs should have no bearing on the MVP. But if Ortiz keeps his heroics up, we might not have to worry about that. I don't care about him not playing defense, when you have pitchers winning the MVP, they don't hit, so why should they win it, and they only pitch every 5 days. A pitcher should be less likely to win the MVP than a DH, at least the DH plays nearly every day.
_________________ "The bigger the lie, the easier it is to believe." - Adolf Hitler
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 6:44 am Posts: 14671 Location: Baton Rouge Gender: Male
Athletic Supporter wrote:
Stripe64 wrote:
As much as I hate to admit it, it should go to A-Rod, unless he struggles and either Ortiz or Guerrero rips it up in the few remaining weeks.
Not if the Yankees miss the playoffs he shouldn't. There are viable candidates on teams that are going to be in. Vlad, Manny, and Ortiz are in a 3 way race IMO, with Vlad being my favorite.
As much as I hate to admit it, it should go to A-Rod, unless he struggles and either Ortiz or Guerrero rips it up in the few remaining weeks.
Not if the Yankees miss the playoffs he shouldn't. There are viable candidates on teams that are going to be in. Vlad, Manny, and Ortiz are in a 3 way race IMO, with Vlad being my favorite.
Manny over A-Rod?
_________________ “You’re good kids, stay together. Trust each other and be good teammates to one another. I believe there is a championship in this room.”
-Ernie Accorsi in his final address to the NY Giants locker room before retiring as GM in January of 2007
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 12:14 am Posts: 8662 Location: IL
Mitchell wrote:
Athletic Supporter wrote:
Stripe64 wrote:
As much as I hate to admit it, it should go to A-Rod, unless he struggles and either Ortiz or Guerrero rips it up in the few remaining weeks.
Not if the Yankees miss the playoffs he shouldn't. There are viable candidates on teams that are going to be in. Vlad, Manny, and Ortiz are in a 3 way race IMO, with Vlad being my favorite.
that should have nothing to do with the mvp
ummm... what universe are you living in?... a team's success almost always factors into the mvp.... you may not like it, but that really doesn't count for much
Joined: Sun May 01, 2005 3:00 pm Posts: 1099 Location: Foxboro, MA (formerly Waltham, MA)
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
Athletic Supporter wrote:
Stripe64 wrote:
As much as I hate to admit it, it should go to A-Rod, unless he struggles and either Ortiz or Guerrero rips it up in the few remaining weeks.
Not if the Yankees miss the playoffs he shouldn't. There are viable candidates on teams that are going to be in. Vlad, Manny, and Ortiz are in a 3 way race IMO, with Vlad being my favorite.
Manny over A-Rod?
well he plays the field, unlike Ortiz
_________________ Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos
As much as I hate to admit it, it should go to A-Rod, unless he struggles and either Ortiz or Guerrero rips it up in the few remaining weeks.
Not if the Yankees miss the playoffs he shouldn't. There are viable candidates on teams that are going to be in. Vlad, Manny, and Ortiz are in a 3 way race IMO, with Vlad being my favorite.
Manny over A-Rod?
well he plays the field, unlike Ortiz
when he decides to play that is...
_________________ “You’re good kids, stay together. Trust each other and be good teammates to one another. I believe there is a championship in this room.”
-Ernie Accorsi in his final address to the NY Giants locker room before retiring as GM in January of 2007
Joined: Sun May 01, 2005 3:00 pm Posts: 1099 Location: Foxboro, MA (formerly Waltham, MA)
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
MattA75 wrote:
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
Athletic Supporter wrote:
Stripe64 wrote:
As much as I hate to admit it, it should go to A-Rod, unless he struggles and either Ortiz or Guerrero rips it up in the few remaining weeks.
Not if the Yankees miss the playoffs he shouldn't. There are viable candidates on teams that are going to be in. Vlad, Manny, and Ortiz are in a 3 way race IMO, with Vlad being my favorite.
Manny over A-Rod?
well he plays the field, unlike Ortiz
when he decides to play that is...
which lately isn't very often
_________________ Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos
I just dug up some numbers to compare A-Rod, Ortiz, and Vlad. What I came up with shows that it is a lot closer between A-rod and Ortiz than some people may realize, taking away the fact that Ortiz doesn't play the field. Vlad is not even close to these two. Considering the fact that pitchers have won the MVP, you can not penalize Ortiz for not playing the field. How often do the pitchers bat, and actually play in the field?? Think about that before you decide on A-Rod because he plays in the field. If you insist on taking into consideration the fact Ortiz is only a DH, than take this fact too. A-Rod is 25th in Errors in the AL
Through September 14, 2005
Ortiz
1. HR, BB, R, SLG
2. Total Bases, and OPS
4. OBP
14. Strike Outs
15. Avg, H
A-Rod
1. R, OPS
2. HR, OBP, SLG
3. Total Bases, BB, AVG
4. SO
7. H
25. Errors
Vlad
3. SLG
5. OBP, AVG, OPS
9. HR
15. Total Bases
20. R
23. BB
29. H
122. SO
_________________ "The bigger the lie, the easier it is to believe." - Adolf Hitler
I just dug up some numbers to compare A-Rod, Ortiz, and Vlad. What I came up with shows that it is a lot closer between A-rod and Ortiz than some people may realize, taking away the fact that Ortiz doesn't play the field. Vlad is not even close to these two. Considering the fact that pitchers have won the MVP, you can not penalize Ortiz for not playing the field. How often do the pitchers bat, and actually play in the field?? Think about that before you decide on A-Rod because he plays in the field. If you insist on taking into consideration the fact Ortiz is only a DH, than take this fact too. A-Rod is 25th in Errors in the AL
if you're going to measure A-Rod's defense, don't use errors - there's better stats out there. Also, park effects should be considered when looking at their offensive stats.
that said, if I had a vote and the season ended today, I'd have to give a lot of consideration to Ortiz.
_________________ “You’re good kids, stay together. Trust each other and be good teammates to one another. I believe there is a championship in this room.”
-Ernie Accorsi in his final address to the NY Giants locker room before retiring as GM in January of 2007
if you're going to measure A-Rod's defense, don't use errors - there's better stats out there. Also, park effects should be considered when looking at their offensive stats.
That's why I said if you insist on taking Ortiz out of consideration for not playing the field to look at where A-Rod stands in errors, personally, I don't care about that, I don't think Ortiz should be penalized for not playing the field.
_________________ "The bigger the lie, the easier it is to believe." - Adolf Hitler
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 6:44 am Posts: 14671 Location: Baton Rouge Gender: Male
Stripe64 wrote:
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
if you're going to measure A-Rod's defense, don't use errors - there's better stats out there. Also, park effects should be considered when looking at their offensive stats.
That's why I said if you insist on taking Ortiz out of consideration for not playing the field to look at where A-Rod stands in errors, personally, I don't care about that, I don't think Ortiz should not be penalized for not playing the field.
if you're going to measure A-Rod's defense, don't use errors - there's better stats out there. Also, park effects should be considered when looking at their offensive stats.
That's why I said if you insist on taking Ortiz out of consideration for not playing the field to look at where A-Rod stands in errors, personally, I don't care about that, I don't think Ortiz should not be penalized for not playing the field.
of course you don't, you're a sox fan
Actually, that has nothing to do with it. Explain to me why Ortiz should be penalized for not playing the field when Clemens and Eckersley, and other pitchers, won the MVP, without taking a swing.
_________________ "The bigger the lie, the easier it is to believe." - Adolf Hitler
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 6:44 am Posts: 14671 Location: Baton Rouge Gender: Male
Stripe64 wrote:
Mitchell wrote:
Stripe64 wrote:
Ricardo Tubbs wrote:
if you're going to measure A-Rod's defense, don't use errors - there's better stats out there. Also, park effects should be considered when looking at their offensive stats.
That's why I said if you insist on taking Ortiz out of consideration for not playing the field to look at where A-Rod stands in errors, personally, I don't care about that, I don't think Ortiz should not be penalized for not playing the field.
of course you don't, you're a sox fan
Actually, that has nothing to do with it. Explain to me why Ortiz should be penalized for not playing the field when Clemens and Eckersley, and other pitchers, won the MVP, without taking a swing.
first of all i don't think those 2 guys should've won the mvp. but, if i were to pretend to climb inside a voter's head, i would say that they made up for the difference by being dominant.
i would say ortiz could make up for the difference if his stats were so much better than anyone else's.
he will almost certainly break the Red Sox record for HR's by a left handed batter in a season
some of the left handed batters from Red Sox past
Teddy Ballgame Yaz Jimmie Foxx Mo Vaughn
didn't Foxx have 50+ at least once or twice?
_________________ “You’re good kids, stay together. Trust each other and be good teammates to one another. I believe there is a championship in this room.”
-Ernie Accorsi in his final address to the NY Giants locker room before retiring as GM in January of 2007
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