AP Interview: Popular Dutch lawmaker urges halt to non-Western immigrants, shutting down radical mosques
- ANTHONY DEUTSCH, Associated Press Writer
Friday, November 19, 2004

(11-19) 11:36 PST THE HAGUE, Netherlands (AP) --

One of the most popular politicians in the Netherlands said Friday the country's democracy is under threat and called for a five-year halt to non-Western immigration in the wake of the killing of a Dutch filmmaker by a suspected Muslim radical.

"We are a Dutch democratic society. We have our own norms and values," right-wing lawmaker Geert Wilders told The Associated Press in an interview. "If you chose radical Islam you can leave, and if you don't leave voluntarily then we will send you away. This is the only message possible."

In his first interview with the foreign media since the slaying of filmmaker Theo van Gogh on Nov. 2, Wilders said his own life has been repeatedly threatened. He said he has begun living under state protection and has even had to stay away from his own home.

Wilders split with the free-market coalition partner Liberal Party two months ago because it backed the candidacy of predominantly Muslim Turkey for the European Union.

He formed his own conservative party, the Wilders Group, which has one seat in the 150-member parliament. But a recent poll suggested his anti-immigrant message was reverberating through the electorate, and he would win 24 seats if elections were held today -- up from 19 seats before Van Gogh's murder.

Wilders said that without swift, bold action, Islamic fundamentalism will topple the country's democratic system.

"The Netherlands has been too tolerant to intolerant people for too long," he said. "We should not import a retarded political Islamic society to our country. There is nothing to be ashamed of to say this. It's not Islam. I speak out against the facts."

In Brussels, Belgium, European Union leaders met Friday to discuss immigration, one of Europe's most pressing and sensitive issues. EU justice and interior ministers agreed to demand that new immigrants learn the language of their adopted countries and adhere to "European values" to guide them toward better integration.

Even as the number of immigrants arriving in Europe falls due to tougher policies, led by a sharp drop in the Netherlands, Wilders said closing the borders isn't enough. Newcomers should be forced to integrate.

"If in a mosque there is recruitment for jihad, it's not a house of prayer, it's a house of war. If it's not a house of prayer, it should be closed down," he said.

Wilders, known for his radical positions and peroxide-blond hair, has been a member of parliament since 1998. He was born and educated in the southern city Venlo, near the German border.

"I'm very tough on radical Islam. I have the toughest ideas on beating this problem and I'm proud of it. I say nothing wrong. I'm no racist, no anti-Islamist," he said.

Wilders and the police took the death threats more seriously following the slaying of Van Gogh, who had produced a television drama critical of how women are treated in some Muslim societies. The filmmaker was shot and stabbed to death, allegedly by a 26-year-old suspected Islamic extremist who holds Dutch and Moroccan citizenship.

The most recent threats were disclosed when two terror suspects, arrested Nov. 10 after a standoff in which several policemen were wounded by a hand grenade, were charged with threatening Wilders and other politicians, their lawyer said.

The latest video threat broadcast on the Internet -- in Dutch, with Arabic music in the background -- condemns Wilders for insulting Islam and offers the reward of paradise for his beheading.

Wilders' style and cause are reminiscent of Pim Fortuyn, a flamboyant political outsider who put immigration on the national agenda before the 2002 elections. Fortuyn was shot to death by an animal rights activist days before the vote, but major parties since have largely embraced his ideas.

Wilders said he is not opposed to mainstream Islam but is concerned by studies saying 10 percent of the Dutch Muslim population -- or about 100,000 people -- support radical Islamic views.

He cited a report by Dutch intelligence saying recruitment for jihad, or holy war, is taking place in as many as 20 mosques in the Netherlands, and said they should be closed and their imams, or preachers, arrested and deported.

"If we don't do anything ... we will lose the country that we have known for centuries. People don't want the Netherlands to be lost, and this is something that I get angry about and I am going to fight for, to keep the country Dutch," he said.

One of the problems facing Europe today is that they are not seeing their population growing with their own citizens, they are just not reproducing at the same rate as the past. Then because of this, there is a need for more people, so you get an influx of foreigners in most cases muslims, a lot of them who study the more strident forms of islam. When they move to their new countries they, unlike the adults born in these places, continue to reproduce at the same rate. As this happens and if the muslims do not become part of the fabric of society of their new countries, you have situations that become problems the more and more their core values go up against what the country they moved to believes in.

Holland as one of, if not the most open society in the world is a case in point to this, but you see the same things happening in France and throughout Europe, but it seems in Holland some of their leaders see the problem growing which leads to what we have now.

I hope the situation in Holland does not grow worse, I fear it will, along with some of the same problems all over Europe. The murder of that filmmaker was just terrible, and if they don't do something soon, the people there will do things they will truly come to regret, I believe that is happening already, with some of the hate crimes against muslims and their mosques going on

I also think another problem is that all of these countires for the most part are becoming more and more secular, which again with the influx of muslims leads to the same type of situation.

You bring up some good points. It is as if Europe is undergoing an immigration boom similar (but not on the same level) as that of the US in decades past.

There will be growing pains, but hopefully things will work out in the end.

Pat Buchanan gets into this very problem, rather extensively, in his book "The Death of the West". Interesting stuff. I do believe that the Netherlands are making the right move to curb the immigration.

Yes but how long can a nation really "curb" immigration?

I have the distinct belief that it is always going to occur from areas less fortunate to those more fortunate.

And what is really wrong with immigration to begin with? Sure there are hiccups, but on the whole, the blending of cultures and the acceptance of the best parts of each makes a society more dynamic and stronger.

Afterall, it worked for the United States. None but the American Indian was born here. This nation was founded by immigrants and it has been immigrants and their decendants who have done everything to make this country great.

I believe you should not fight immigration, unless you want to weaken your own society.

tsunami

i was in Holland when this whole mess started and i spoke to a couple of different people, mainly the "man on the street" types.

Most of my Dutch colleagues ( i work for a dutch company) were surprised when something like this happened, esp with the whole Theo Van Gogh issue( despite what the press says, he is really NOT well liked by a lot of Dutch people). In fact, there were some trouble in The Hague, in which the commandos were called in to infiltrate a suspected terrorist base, a lot of them were passinga round jokes like "oh, they finally got some work to do?"
Most of these problems arise from Moroccan and/or Turkish immigrants who refuse or find it difficult to assimilate into the very tolerant Dutch culture.

Now, when i speak to 3rd gen Moroccan immigrants ( who most of them can speak Dutch, Arabic, French and English) they generally blame the elders and their brethen who refuse to even learn the ways of the Dutch or the language. They say that being a Muslim does not stop you fropm adapting to the culture of the country in which you stay in.

I hope things work out in the right direction in Holland. Things have cool down a bit since the last week i was there.....

Wouldn't they all just be happier if they had wooden shoes and little dairy maid hats to wear? I know that'd make me a happy citizen!

I am all for immigration and I can see where this guy is coming from. There are a ton of countries in the world where people who live would come to western countries and live in places you and I wouldn't even send our worst enemies just to try and better themselves. This is what immigration is. The fact that the muslims are the complaint de jour is not a good thing. Do we still visit Chinatown in our cities or should the fact that their are Chinese signs and the person at the counter barely understands English make for a deportation.

In Toronto here they want to take school marks and break them down by ethnic parties. So many people are against this. I say let them do it. If you want to come to Canada and not teach your children English or French before they go to school. Why should my child suffer when they are being held back because they already know the language. So if you don't want to comply with at least some of the rules, you will never totally integrate with that society. Not that you have to totally integrate but you should at least step up to the minimum requirements of the society.

This is not a new problem in Holland, it's why Pim Fortuyn's party was going to win the election and he was going to be the Prime Minister there before he was killed a few years ago.

I don't know what exactly can be done, is blocking all immigrants going to solve it? Not unless they get the people already there to become a part of their society, and I don't know how you force people to do that.

In France I think the problem is going to become even worse, that's one of the reasons anti-semitism is on the rise there, as well as some of the other countries where this is happening.

I think you can safely say you need governments who have a clear message, whatever it is, and they all must find a way to get the new citizens of their countries to blend in at least a little, and adapt more to what these places are all about.

Just a few aditions, i doubt that Fortuyn would be prime minister if he wasnt killed, nonetheless his stance on the topic of immigrants is something a lot of people here can relate to, mostly because of fear and unknowingness of a strange and different culture, that Wilders guy is almost exactly the same as Fortuyn and getting quite popular for it. But as soon as everything is calmed down his rating will drop, is my idea..

Muslims and immigrants (with all sorts of religions) in general have always been a part of the Dutch society, but because of a small group preaching a extreme point of view that isnt something dutch are acquinted to a lot of disbelieve and even anger is felt by some/ maybe many, but from where i work live i have contact with muslims and they didnt like the Van Gogh guy, but dont see that violence can be an answer in a matter like this. Also Imams, mosks and other muslim organistaions have spoken out against the things that happened, and a number of initiatives is already executed to show the 'gap' between the mayority of people here aint that big at all.

Next to that immigration laws have been sharpened a couple of years ago, and now people with solely economic reasons to come here are not permitted. As an effect the number of 'new' citizens has decreased enormously.