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 Post subject: Crips co-founder sentenced to die
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 7:33 pm 
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Thursday, December 01, 2005
Williams execution penalty is likened to a 'lynching'
At Los Angeles rally at City Hall, clemency is urged for the convicted killer and Crips co-founder, who is scheduled to die this month.
By Gordon Smith
Copley News Service

Black leaders joined death penalty foes -- including Los Angeles City Councilman Bill Rosendahl -- at a rally at City Hall on Wednesday to urge Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger to grant clemency to convicted murderer Stanley "Tookie" Williams.

At least one speaker compared thescheduled Dec. 13 execution of Williams to a "lynching," and said the co-founder of the infamous Crips gang in Los Angeles has redeemed himself in prison by working to end gang violence.

The rally was one of a dozen events scheduled from Sacramento to San Diego on Wednesday to protest the death penalty and plead for Williams' life to be spared.

The protests came on the same day that the California Supreme Court denied a motion by lawyers for Williams to reopen his case based on a new law that they claimed would give them access to more evidence. The court's decision was 4-2.

Williams, who grew up in South Los Angeles, was convicted in Torrance Superior Court and sentenced to death in 1981 for murdering four people -- including the owners of a Gardena-area motel and their daughter -- in 1979. He has steadfastly proclaimed that he is innocent of those crimes.

In recent years, Williams has acknowledged the "damage" that he and other gang members have caused, and has written a series of children's books aimed at persuading youngsters to avoid getting caught up in gangs.

"His impact, his work and his life is a testament to what rehabilitation is all about," said Jamal Watkins, western region director for the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People. "We cannot stand behind a system that is systematically lynching our community."

Watkins later explained that "the death penalty has disproportionately affected people of color for decades. In that sense it reflects the concept of a modern-day lynching."

Bonnie Williams-Taylor, who said she was married to Williams from 1972 to 1984, insisted he was "railroaded" by police for crimes he didn't commit.

"Yes, he was a co-founder of a gang," she said. "But he is innocent and does not deserve to die."

Rosendahl, whose district includes Westchester and Playa del Rey, said he would not pass judgment on whether Williams is guilty of murder.

"But the execution of a person, be they guilty or not, is not something the United States should continue to do," he said.

"I say to Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger, clemency, clemency, clemency."

Williams' lawyers have petitioned Schwarzenegger to block their client's execution on the grounds that his message about the futility and waste of gang violence has had a positive impact on the lives of many people.

But District Attorney Steve Cooley and other law enforcement officials have urged the governor to let Williams be put to death "for the execution-style shotgun murders of four innocent, defenseless human beings."

Schwarzenegger has scheduled a private hearing Dec. 8 to listen to both sides.

Jorja Leap, an adjunct professor of social welfare at UCLA who evaluates gang intervention programs, said Williams "has major credibility with at-risk youth. His books and his works are an important part of prevention and intervention efforts." She also credited him with helping to create a broad dialogue about gang problems.

On the other hand, she noted, Williams "has not renounced his gang ties. There's no disputing that."

About 70 people attended Wednesday's rally, and afterward marched to the state building in downtown Los Angeles, chanting, "Let Tookie live!"

Earlier, the rally was briefly disrupted by a man who sharply criticized Williams.

"He's unleashed a lethal cancer in the community. If anyone should die, he should die!" the man shouted. He identified himself as Jerome Roy, and said he was homeless.






Find this article at:
http://www.dailybreeze.com/news/articles/2039862.html

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The comparison of the case to a lynching makes me wonder what difference there is between a death carried out under the laws of the bureaucracy and an actual lynching. Considering the media coverage, there is more public bloodlust in the former; whearas, the latter is more cathartic.

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Last edited by TomJoad187 on Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:18 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:00 pm 
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I don't quite get the title of this thread.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:25 pm 
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Green Habit wrote:
I don't quite get the title of this thread.


nor do i.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:31 pm 
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No one would have called it a lynching if the inmate was white.

>obvious<


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:37 pm 
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so let me get this straight: he was convicted of killing four people, and sentenced to death.

but now his fans say he's been rehabilitated and should be saved from death.

well, if he was sentenced differently, with a chance for parole, he would have that shot.

but he killed four innocent people, so he doesn't.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:56 pm 
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corduroy_blazer wrote:
Green Habit wrote:
I don't quite get the title of this thread.


nor do i.


Sorry, I was making a prediction about what all the radio talk show people were going to be screaming about...I'm not funny. :oops:

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:06 pm 
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The death penalty is wrong.

He should be locked in a 10x10 cell, underground, by himself, for the rest of his natural life.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:24 pm 
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corduroy_blazer wrote:
so let me get this straight: he was convicted of killing four people, and sentenced to death.

but now his fans say he's been rehabilitated and should be saved from death.

well, if he was sentenced differently, with a chance for parole, he would have that shot.

but he killed four innocent people, so he doesn't.


What is the justice system supposed to do to criminals? Is it a supposed to rehabilitate, or is it supposed to exact revenge? If it's rehabilitation, could he not have been rehabilitated since 1981? I don't know if I want it to be based on revenge.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:32 pm 
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TomJoad187 wrote:
corduroy_blazer wrote:
so let me get this straight: he was convicted of killing four people, and sentenced to death.

but now his fans say he's been rehabilitated and should be saved from death.

well, if he was sentenced differently, with a chance for parole, he would have that shot.

but he killed four innocent people, so he doesn't.


What is the justice system supposed to do to criminals? Is it a supposed to rehabilitate, or is it supposed to exact revenge? If it's rehabilitation, could he not have been rehabilitated since 1981? I don't know if I want it to be based on revenge.


how do we ever really know a person who killed four people is rehabilitated? i'm not a supporter of the death penalty, but in some ways it works.

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No matter how dark the storm gets overhead
They say someone's watching from the calm at the edge
What about us when we're down here in it?
We gotta watch our backs


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:40 pm 
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corduroy_blazer wrote:
i'm not a supporter of the death penalty, but in some ways it works.


What ways are those?

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:44 pm 
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B wrote:
corduroy_blazer wrote:
i'm not a supporter of the death penalty, but in some ways it works.


What ways are those?
stopping repeat offenders before hand?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:51 pm 
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warehouse wrote:
B wrote:
corduroy_blazer wrote:
i'm not a supporter of the death penalty, but in some ways it works.


What ways are those?


stopping repeat offenders before hand?


As opposed to prison, which wouldn't do this as well?

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:55 pm 
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energystar wrote:
warehouse wrote:
B wrote:
corduroy_blazer wrote:
i'm not a supporter of the death penalty, but in some ways it works.


What ways are those?


stopping repeat offenders before hand?


As opposed to prison, which wouldn't do this as well?
inmates dont kill other inmates?

i dont really know when death penalty should be used actually. i dont think it should be abolished all together because i honestly believe some people dont deserve to live, like child molesters. i also dont think it stops repeat offenders either as much as im playing devils advocate.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:07 pm 
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warehouse wrote:
energystar wrote:
warehouse wrote:
B wrote:
corduroy_blazer wrote:
i'm not a supporter of the death penalty, but in some ways it works.


What ways are those?


stopping repeat offenders before hand?


As opposed to prison, which wouldn't do this as well?

inmates dont kill other inmates?

i dont really know when death penalty should be used actually. i dont think it should be abolished all together because i honestly believe some people dont deserve to live, like child molesters. i also dont think it stops repeat offenders either as much as im playing devils advocate.


You mentioned playing devil's advocate, so I assume you're not seriously implying that the death penalty should be used to prevent convicted serial killers from killing other convicted serial killers.

And I've always been under the impression that convicted child molesters live an extremely miserable existence in prison, since even the most cold-hearted murderer is repulsed by the idea.

_________________
When the last living thing
Has died on account of us,
How poetical it would be
If Earth could say,
In a voice floating up
Perhaps
From the floor
Of the Grand Canyon,
"It is done.
People did not like it here.''


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:10 pm 
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energystar wrote:
And I've always been under the impression that convicted child molesters live an extremely miserable existence in prison, since even the most cold-hearted murderer is repulsed by the idea.
i dont even think they deserve prison food. id like to see them taken into the streets and killed publically.

and i was playing devils advocate saying it stops potential repeat offenders, but i dont think id be against the death penalty for multiple-time offenders

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:18 pm 
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warehouse wrote:
energystar wrote:
And I've always been under the impression that convicted child molesters live an extremely miserable existence in prison, since even the most cold-hearted murderer is repulsed by the idea.
i dont even think they deserve prison food. id like to see them taken into the streets and killed publically.

and i was playing devils advocate saying it stops potential repeat offenders, but i dont think id be against the death penalty for multiple-time offenders


or say, someone like timothy mcveigh?

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No matter how dark the storm gets overhead
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What about us when we're down here in it?
We gotta watch our backs


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:22 pm 
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corduroy_blazer wrote:
warehouse wrote:
energystar wrote:
And I've always been under the impression that convicted child molesters live an extremely miserable existence in prison, since even the most cold-hearted murderer is repulsed by the idea.
i dont even think they deserve prison food. id like to see them taken into the streets and killed publically.

and i was playing devils advocate saying it stops potential repeat offenders, but i dont think id be against the death penalty for multiple-time offenders


or say, someone like timothy mcveigh?
yeah. but i remember reading a quote from tim mcveigh about how the score was "463-1" which not only shows no sign of remorse, but shows no sign of hope for rehibilitation, so i have no problem with the government killing him. if anything, my biggest problem with the death penalty is the bullshit rhetoric that always follows this issue. although, you could probly say that for most issues now.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:23 pm 
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would the death of williams further persuade kids to not join a gang, considering they would see it could get them killed?

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No matter how dark the storm gets overhead
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What about us when we're down here in it?
We gotta watch our backs


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:24 pm 
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corduroy_blazer wrote:
would the death of williams further persuade kids to not join a gang, considering they would see it could get them killed?


Yeah cause otherwise they might think being in a gang is safe. Its not like gang member get killed on the streets.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2005 12:06 am 
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i have no problem at all with the death penalty


cases i think it should be used:

premeditated murder - if youre callous enough to actually plot in advance how and when and where to kill someone, you just forefit your life

pedophiles - im not even going into this. some say its a choice, some say its a sickness

rapists - use handlotion and your imaginiation dumbasses

murder - while not planned, you had complete control over. for example, you run into a group of kids cause you drank yourself or shot yourself up high

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