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 Post subject: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 2:14 pm 
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I've written extensively about Avocado and I think I'll repost my first reaction after I finally got a full leaked copy. But what I remember about Avocado even more than the music was the experience of sharing it with RM. i've been a die hard fan since my first listen of Ten 15 years ago and it was easy to find pearl jam fans in the 90s. But I've never really had a collection of die hards I could live and breathe the records with until I found RM, and Avocado was the first time I got to share my first time, the anticipation and the discovery, with people who cared as much as I did. Even before the album came out we had threads for each song that were running 10-25 pages long (keeping this place clean was a fuck ton of work). It was the most immersive experience I've ever had with a record and I loved just about every second of it. And there will never be another 'first time' like that.

Anyway, here was my long 'first listen' review

I just went for a walk because I wanted to be alone with the new songs and really take them in. About halfway through the walk I let out the breath I didn’t even realize I was holding in and broke into a huge smile. Pearl Jam has been a frustrating band for me for the past 12 years. The first three albums were for a long time my three favorite records of all time. Vitalogy and Ten are still 1+3. For me Pearl Jam embodied everything great about music and since their first record they have been one of the most important constants in my life. Then they seemed to lose their way. The last four records never were truly ‘Pearl Jam’ records, at least not for me. They had their moments of greatness, and Yield especially was a strong, near great, record. But there was always something missing. They were very good rock records but they weren’t Pearl Jam. This whole time the elements were present, and the live shows were as good as ever, but something didn’t click. They never reached the potential that was so obviously there.

About 1:00, Friday March 7th, I realized that Pearl Jam had returned, and I’m not sure I realized until now how much I’ve missed them. This record is a masterpiece, and while it’s been 3 and a half years since Riot Act, I’ve waited almost 12 years for this record. It was worth it.

It’s early to be ranking this compared to the other albums. I still have not heard finished versions of the 4 songs from the previous s leak, and the quality of the new leak is sub-par. But I’m predicting that this will be my third favorite record of theirs, topped only by Vitalogy and Ten. It’s amazing. However, this record sounds nothing like Ten or really Vitalogy either. I make that comparison only in terms of how much I like it. It takes what’s best from their career, distills, and updates it. Eddie can’t sing like he used to (for some of you that’s a good thing) but the feeling and the passion is back. These songs are epic in the best sense of the word. For the first time in a long time (with a few notable exceptions) these songs sound like they matter—that it is important you listen to them.

I’m not going to comment on the previously leaked songs. I’ve done so elsewhere, and I still have not heard finished versions. I may stick that in later. I also won’t comment much on lyrics since I haven’t had time to puzzle them out yet. I’ll also make a number of comparisons to other songs. Take them with a grain of salt. Nothing here is a clone, but I’ve always found its helpful to have something to picture if you haven’t heard the music yet. A general note about Boom. He’s in most of these songs but used VERY well. He adds texture when appropriate and disappears when he is not needed. Mike is one of the stars of this record and Eddie’s vocals are very strong on these new tracks. I think it’s Matt’s best work with PJ as well.

Marker in the Sand: starts with a catchy riff and a rolling groove. It’s good. But where this song really triumphs is in the chorus. It’s still new to me but I think this may be the best chorus they’ve ever written. Fucking incredible. The problem is that it doesn’t flow well with the verses. These are two separate songs and I’m not sure how well they connect. But that chorus. Wow. From what I can tell this seems to be another anti-war song, wondering how God can condone something like war. It reminds me in content (not sound) of the ‘how does god choose’ verse from Tom Waits’ The Day After Tomorrow. The bridge is completely superfluous and disposable, unfortunately, but it doesn’t take away from the song. I don’t want to oversell it, but that chorus. It’s why God invented music. Some of the finest stuff they’ve ever put down.


Big Wave: This song is total Soundgarden. Think my wave meets kickstand. It would fit right in on Superunknown. Fun big rock riff. It seems to lack some substance but I haven’t listened that closely yet—there might be something more going on here which would really help elevate the song. This could have been a b-side, albeit a great b-side. It’s the only real rocker on the back half of the album. Eddie sounds great and this should be a ton of fun live. Nice work from Mike here (he shines on this album). This song reminds me a bit of what get right wanted to be but couldn’t pull off.

Gone: I was not a big fan of the demo or the live version but they did a masterful job turning this into an album track. The melody is on an acoustic guitar with some nice atmospheric coloring that never gets too busy (frequently a problem on songs Eddie writes that don’t need 3 guitars but they have to find something for everyone to do). But like Marker In The Sand it come alive on the chorus, which positively soars in a way nothing has since Yield. It reminds me a bit of In Hiding, but better (bear in mind I am not a huge In Hiding fan). This song captures the feel of Ten (without the RAWK that turns a lot of people off) better than anything else on the record. Like with Marker In The Sand, you get the feeling that you are listening to something important that really taps into the part of your soul that wants to be believe that we can transcend everything in this world that ties us down and holds us back. Mike (I assume) has a nice little guitar riff to close the song out too

Army Reserve: This reminds me a bit, especially in the verses, of Jeff Buckley’s Last Goodbye. I’m guessing that once the lyrics are deciphered this will be the most emotionally affecting song on the album. It seems to be about the emotional connection between a young girl and her father, who was called up to go fight. She is what’s getting him through the experience—the fact that she believes in him and his desire to get back to her. One line that really jumps out me “she tells herself and anyone else ‘father’s risking his life for our freedom’” Like Marker in the Sand its ultimately a positive song—poignant without the anger in WWS and the depression that marks Riot Act. It’s a celebration of the human spirit in the face of adversity, and Eddie is smart enough here to not overdo the Bush bashing. It’s there in the context and the song works better for it

Wasted Reprise: This worked better than I thought it would. The organ sounds a bit like Tom Waits’ Innocent When You Dream. Definitely more poignant than Life Wasted. It really highlights how that song could have gone in two different directions


Come Back: If Parachutes is their tribute to the Beatles this is their tribute to Elvis. It is a total white blues classic rock torch song, and is nice for what it is. The music isn’t that interesting but Eddie is at the top of his game here. I’ll really need to hear the lyrics before I can really get into the song. Where the song really shines is in the last minute or two, where Eddie pleads ‘come back, I’ll be here’. This part feels totally inspired by the ‘we belong together’ tag from black, although without the ragged desperation of the early years. It’s beautiful. This should play really well live

Inside Job: There is a two minute instrumental before the song really kicks into gear, dominated by a piano and acoustic guitar. It works really well—it may be my favorite part of the song. Like a lot of these songs, it gives you the sense that what you’re listening to is important, a feeling that has been missing from the last few records. The song itself runs a bit long. Right now it feels like they could have cut 30-45 seconds and had a stronger song, but there is more going on here than in Off He Goes, so it’s not too much of a problem. I think Mike’s lyrics are better than Stone or Jeff’s (and certainly Mike) but not quite up to Eddie’s level. About 3 and a half minutes in it really picks up. As far as closers go it’s very good. Not release/indifference/immortality good, but very good nonetheless. It ends on a nice, empowering note

There is a nice little outro piece of music that sounds like one of those little instrumental tracks from Touring Band. I always forget the names.

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 2:18 pm 
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Now that it's been a year most of my first impressions remained fairly accurate

Life Wasted: I like it even more now than I did then.
WWS: Like it as much--still a top 5 PJ song for me
Comatose: Like it even more. A top 20 song now
Severed Hand: Was my second favorite song on the record for a while (or even tied with WWS)--this one has probably gone down the most over time. I still like it a lot, but the luster has faded
Marker In The Sand: The chorus doesn't have the same power it once did but I actually like the song a bit more as a whole
Parachutes: Improved
Unemployable: Improved
Big Wave: Fun for what it is
Gone: This one has taken another big hit from me. An early favorite that I almost always skip now
Army Reserve: Still really sad, but this never quite moved into the top tier like I expected it to
Come Back: Like a lot--the song still pays its way in the last minute
Inside Job--This one has also lost a bit of a step for me. I like the climax to it but the build up takes a bit too long

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 2:32 pm 
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I heard WWS and Unemployable (via the 'single') first. WWS took a while to grow on me, but I kind of liked it. I didn't like Unemployable very much at all. I ignored the first few 'leaked' songs, but when the entire album leaked I downloaded it.

The first time I listened to it was on a Saturday morning as I drove to Tucson. I didn't like it.

Not in the way I didn't enjoy my first listen to many of their other albums, though. With Binaural and Riot Act and convinced myself I liked them and listened a lot and tried to push away the little voice in the back of my head saying, "Meh."

Avocado wasn't like that. There were some catchy songs, some stuff I liked, and I focused on that. I also didn't play the album to death. Even by the time the album was finishing, I still had MITS stuck in my head. I went back and listened to it a few times, and I had that chorus in my head the rest of the day. I figured if PJ were to release it as a single it could be huge. I figured at that point they probably would never release it.

I wrote to a few friends about my disappointment with the album. One friend simply said, Look, all your favorite records are ones that didn't grab you at first, but grew on you. Give it another spin.

How right she was.

Ultimately, the album came to me in bits and pieces. First I fell for WWS and MITS, then I started digging Severed Hand, Life Wasted, Inside Job, and Come Back. One by one I came to love every song. Parachutes was probably the last one to really get me, and even still I like it more in its place on the album than I do on its own.

Nonetheless, even more than a year on, Avocado remains as one of my favorite PJ records. I'd probably put it just below Vs., but the two are very hard to compare. One thing the two albums have in common: They are the only 2 PJ records I can play without ever even being tempted to skip a song.


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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 3:48 pm 
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i remember not really liking WWS when i first heard it. then when the whole thing leaked i listened to it once and didn't know what to make of it but liked it quite alright. when i got the actually album it turned out it was just excitement of hearing new stuff from the band, and not necessarily the quality of the music that sprung out to me (that might be a dutch only expression). The only song of it that left me a lasting impression is Army Reserve.


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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 4:05 pm 
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conoalias wrote:
it was just excitement of hearing new stuff from the band, and not necessarily the quality of the music that sprung out to me (that might be a dutch only expression). The only song of it that left me a lasting impression is Army Reserve.


it translates. we say jumped out at me. or something like that. so it works. :wink:


first time for me...well i was very excited. even though i was a fan when riot act came out, i wasn't like a huge fan anxiously awaiting the album. so s/t was really the first PJ i was dying to hear.

my initial reaction was that i enjoyed it, being very glad to hear a rock record again. but at the same time, on the first listen, nothing really stood out to me. i liked MITS, Come Back and Inside Job. But everything else was good, but kinda blended together. But I kept listening..and really came to like it. i dont think it came out of my cd player in my car for two months. the only track i skip is gone. it is the perfect example of one line absolutely ruining a song. (gas in the tank...)

i now think its a solid album. good not great. i'd rank it at about #5 or so. i still think severed hand and comatose are very overrated. not bad, but nothing that good either. i think Army Reserve is very underrated. I can't figure out why people don't love the song. It's story is so powerful.

So i liked it. It was really fun anticipating a PJ album that much and not being let down.

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 5:30 pm 
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I didn't get to hear any leaks, so I only listened to this album after actually buying it. I was fucking excited to see what they would come up with... and that was quite a let down. It's the first time ever that I wanted to skip PJ songs. I couldn't believe it. I really had to force myself not to do so. Since the slow songs didn't move me at all, I first gave all my attention to the rockers, and there wasn't anything to be crazy about. Then I tried listening to the lyrics and it was a real shock, and in a bad way.

A part of me tried to like this album, because it's a fucking pearl jam record and there hadn't been any pj record I didn't like so far, but I faced it : I don't like this one and I'm never going back again listening.

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 6:25 pm 
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Well, being the captain of Team Avocado in the PJ Olympics, I figured I must post in this.

Even though I had enjoyed Pearl Jam throughout their career, nothing that they put out had grabbed me immediately since Vitalogy... until I heard "World Wide Suicide" for the first time.

THIS was the Pearl Jam I loved. THIS was the Pearl Jam I missed. And I was glad to have them back.

Hearing "Life Wasted" and "Comatose" for the first time knocked my blocks off. I think I must've listened to LW at least 50 times within the first 24 hours that I heard the song.

As far as the Avocado album itself, I think it's one of their strongest pieces of work. Just solid songs from front to back. Every album from Vitalogy onward had at least 1 or 2 songs that I would normally skip when listening to the albums. With Avocado, there was none. I even enjoyed "Wasted Reprise".

While it's not the 5-star album that I claimed it was when it was first released, I still give it at least 4 stars.

Life Wasted - 5/5
WWS - 5/5
Comatose - 5/5
Severed Hand - 4/5
Marker in the Sand - 4/5
Parachutes - 3.5/5
Unemployable - 4/5
Big Wave - 3.5/5
Gone - 2/5 (my least favorite)
Wasted Reprise - 2/5
Army Reserve - 3.5/5
Come Back - 3/5
Inside Job - 4/5

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 3:36 am 
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Bought it and Tool on the day they came out. I kinda payed more attention to the Tool album but Avocado was a goddamn solid album. Much better than Riot Act and miles ahead of Binaural.

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 5:59 am 
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I hadn't listened to pop music in years.

And I especially hadn't listened to Pearl Jam. I thought Kurt Cobain was the voice of a generation, and I listened when he told me that Pearl Jam was Warrant in grunge clothing. Then, many years later, my daughter, who was in sixth grade at the time became a fan through friends at school. That was surprising to me because she was barely alive when Pearl Jam was having it's heyday. What was even more surprising was the encyclopedic knowledge that some of these kids had about Pearl Jam. Where did this devotion come from?

A huge point was made to get the new Pearl Jam album the day that it came out. I still didn't really "get" it, but I had some understanding when I heard WORLD WIDE SUICIDE on the radio. What a great tune. Everything about that song is perfect. But I wasn't ready to get into them. It really started for me during the 2006 tour. They were coming to a town near us. My daughter wanted to go, and my husband was really encouraging, but she was too young to go alone, and I, even though I loved WWS, had Adam Sandler's Operaman EVEN FLOW take-offs ringing in my head. How could I stand that for 90 minutes or more? By the time I had waffled about it, the show was sold out. To add insult to injury SOLD-OUT was stamped all over the posters that lined the town we were in. My daughter was not a happy camper. So...she made me listen to one of their albums. She wisely chose S/T. It's so tight musically that it makes a fantastic listen.

They've had albums that have had more great songs (Vitalogy), but this is just a great listen from top to bottom. Probably the best listen of any of their albums. And unlike the rest of you, I love GONE and COME BACK.


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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:04 am 
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My first listen to S/T (I still hate that people call it Avocado) was nothing spectacular. I knew all the songs because of the leaks, and was still digesting them when the actual record came out. It was more fun for me to quiz my brother and friends about the album, for it was brand spanking new to them. My best friend said it was their best album since Vitalogy. I wanted to smack him.

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:43 am 
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I remember really liking Gone at first. I must have been very drunk.

I also remember totally spamming the Marker thread. I still do every now and then.


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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 3:19 pm 
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Still trying to like this album. There is absolutely no vibe to the album whatsoever. It feels like it was produced by factory workers on the minimum wage who are operating a recreated robot version of Pearl Jam.


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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 3:52 pm 
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SLH916 wrote:
And unlike the rest of you, I love GONE and COME BACK.


:heartbeat: U


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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:35 pm 
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Bought it the day it came out. Liked the guitars being out front and the rockers right from the get go. Parachutes was a definite left turn along the way, the album slowly fades for a few songs then ends on a high note. Sound wise I love this album, lyric wise it's hit and miss, song wise it's hit and miss, overall a good effort but I believe they can do better.

Looking back I think I made a pretty good assessment. Where the album is good it's really good. Where it's bad it's still passable but fall short of Pearl jam standards. Best sounding Pearl Jam album since Yield. Mike is becoming the best songwriter in the band. Ed shows he can still write a rocker and happily Cameron has a smaller songwriting roll (though I'd still love Stone and Cameron to work together).

Over a year later my faves still haven't changed;
Inside Job - their best song since Yield,
Life Wasted - shocked this wasn't a big radio hit but horrible video
Unemployable - just like the song

Gone has grown on me
Come Back has gone down a little

Overall a nice and safe album. 7 out 10. But I think Pearl Jam has at least another 9 or 10 out of ten in them.


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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 8:02 am 
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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 8:06 pm 
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I got my Avocado in the mail the day before it was released. It was the day before I did my radio show and luckily I was able to make the CD my feature album of the morning the next day.

I liked the album from the get go. I had not downloaded any of the songs before it was released. I read some of the lyrics and was a little worried. I thought Unemployable and Come Back were a little easy...almost basic writing skills (and I still do to an extent).

But once I heard to songs from the studio speakers, I knew the album was going to be a top 2 pj record. I still can't beleive it's been a year. I don't wanna go into too much detail, cuz I am at work...but other than Gone, which I think is dull and very weak and Army Reserve which is a great tune, but I just can't get into the way Ed sings it...the album is flawless. I love every other song. Even Comatose, which I didn't like at first listen.

It's not my #1 PJ album...tied with Yield.


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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 10:56 pm 
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I forget my first time...


Seriously though, I had all the leaked song weeks before release, but I never listened until my disc came in the mail from 10C.

Now I remember. I listened to it on headphones in my living room after my family went to sleep. I liked it quite a bit. I listened to it on repeat in my car for about 3 weeks straight, but I haven't listened to it straight through in over a year. I probably should break it out again.

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 4:11 pm 
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can't stand the album
the songs ... the production .... the cover art....the label.... all the marketing scams

pearl jam died after the greatness of riot act apparently

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 6:46 pm 
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Like stip and some others, this was my first real experience of a new PJ album with a community like this. I heard Crapshoot from the first show it was played at and I remember thinking it kicked a little bit of ass, and I even made myself a remix of the fan audio on Audacity that sounded a lot better. But while I wouldn't say it was a top 10 or anything, it kicked ass and I loved it. Next, I remember hearing a 15 sec. promo of WWS, and thinking "Wow, this sucks". It was just the chorus, which yeah isn't that good, especially by itself. I heard WWS full song and I like it a lot, but I did wear it out, and a little bit of it may have been due to it being new Pearl Jam, and I still love certain parts, but as a whole it's not one of my favorites... still hate the intro. Unemployable though, wow that one was instantly a song I loved and still do. I feel a lot more emotion/connection here than in WWS. Next 4 I heard were(oh, in mono btw) LW, Comatose(finished Crapshoot), Parachutes, and Severed Hand(with the glitch at the bridge!). Life Wasted I liked a lot, but I never was too big on the solo and didn't really care about the final cut of it cutting it out. Comatose I thought was weird, cause it was slower, and his voice was odd. I did eventually get used to it and got into it and now it's one of my favorite PJ rockers; love the big opening. Parachutes was a little happy song and I loved it. Severed Hand really kicked ass, I couldn't pick between it and Parachutes as my favorite of the 4. But it did glitch at the bridge and I could tell that part was gonna be really awesome on the final version, which it was. Next, the whole album leaked in semi-bad quality. Loved Army Reserve(I remember it reminded me of Counting Blue Cars by Dishwalla), and Inside Job was amazing when it still surprised me for the music to kick in. Also, some of the songs, Life Wasted and Comatose especially, sounded a little odd to me in stereo just with the different guitar parts being more audible. Loved the album as a whole. Loved Come Back, a few others probably, disliked Big Wave a lot. a lot lot lot lot lot. I really liked Gone I think, something that has gone away.

Then it leaked in high quality, and I got to like Come Back more, and over tiem MitS became a favorite.

Some of this is still true, some not, but this and Ten probably get the least play of all my albums(even if I love indiv. songs, they just don't call me to listen too often), although the only ones I've really put in my stereo lately have been RA, Yield, and No Code. Vs was getting some regular play early summer though.

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 Post subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Time: Avocado
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 1:08 pm 
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I wasn't that big a fan of Life Wasted or WWS when the were first released. I got the album anyway because, well, it's Pearl Jam.
I really like Life Wasted now but WWS never grew on me.
The first song that really stuck with me, and is probably still my favorite, is Army Reserve. A beautiful song about the relationship between a mother and son who's father is deployed presumably in Iraq. The mother struggles to justify his absence and raise her son without a fatherly figure. I like the line "The empty chair begets him, how loud can silence get."
I liked Severed Hand at first listen which came on my ipod when i was at the gym. The part where the siren goes off comes on and I didn't know it was a part of the song. I thought a fire alarm was going off and I almost fell off the treadmill and shat my pants.
Comatose is another hard rocker I liked right away and a good song to come on when I'm working out.
I thought unemployable was pretty cool and I really like how it mellows out at the end.
I can't explain why, but I think Parachutes is great in its place on the album.
Big Wave is a fun song, if nothing else.
I think Inside Job is a great closer and I actually like the long intro to it, I think it just builds up the anticipation. Hats off the Mike. However, I think it hurst Come Back. It's two closers back to back and one is just better. I don't have a better solution of where to place Come Back, but I find myself often skipping to get to Inside Job.
All in all, I think the band was musically and lyrically top notch on this album. However, I still have trouble getting used to Eddie's vocals. I feel like he really pulled back on RA, which really helped with the mood of that album as Stip explained in another thread, but I also think he knew he couldn't sing like he used to.
Now, it's almost like he realized people don't care that he can't hit those same notes, they just want that passion back. And it is back. I think his passion on these songs transcend his vocal performance. But knowing I can put on VS. and really hear Eddie rip into a song keeps S/T out of heavy rotation in my cd player.

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